Channeling for Charlie request

[dyrl]

Hey guys,

first a brief pre-lude so as not to offend the mild hearted:

COURTEOUS WARNING:

a) It's not about me - I'm fine - it's about someone else.

b) If you don't want to be sad, stop reading.

I don't want to make anyone sad, and I'm not "sad" myself, but rather pretty much accept "it" - but still, out of courtesy to others - I repeat - if you are in a great mood, and think the world smells of red roses and life is great - stop reading - and have a nice day. I don't want to ruin it.

If, on the other hand, you can endure a pretty down to earth sad story and say a little prayer or think a little thought - it would be much appreciated.

To those of you who can - scroll down.























Commence sad news:

I have four dogs; the youngest of which, Oz, was even featured in a photo somewhere in the toy threads as he was beating up Animated Megatron.

Sadly, my oldest dog - a St. Bernard named Charlie - is on his last legs. He's 10 years old, which for a St. Bernard is the upper limit of life expetancy.

I used to have a cat named Motorhead (well, in Polish it sounds better ) - he lived - I kid you not - 21 years. Got him when I was a little kid - and he died when I was a grown man, after college and having begun working in my adult life.

A second beagle I have is 14 years old and doing fine (14 year for a beagle is like a million life times).

I guess I was lucky. Sadly, Charlie isn't lucky. He's got lung cancer and it's pretty advanced. Also, he has a very weak heart.

The vet gave us the option of putting him to sleep - but I am opposed to euthenasia and that even goes for animals. We put him on medication to clean the water out of his lungs and to keep his heart going.

I'm happy we did it because for the last weak (when he could have been euthenized), Charlie spent his time enjoying the wonderful "Christmas" snow that we have now in Poland. Not cold icy wind, no freezing temperatures - just beautiful bright sun shine and a thick layer of lovely lovely soft snow.

It's as if the Fates have decided to give my St. Bernard a going away present: the best possible weather that his race of dog could ask for.

He's rolled round in the snow or sat on the stairs all day breathing and letting snow flakes tickle his nose. Whenever I'd be outside, he'd walk by me, even though he hasn't got the strength to walk really far. He even barked when he heard some sound and generally did all the things a dog likes to do when outside.

Although his condition has worsened day by day, today it's the worse it's been. I get the feeling he's not going to survive the night - and if he does - he doesn't have long now until he meets his maker.

Anyways - he's been a great dog. Never once did I have a problem with him. He didn't need to be "trained" because he understood everything always and was the type of dog that just took charge and was intelligent and loyal. The quiet type, he was just the stereotypical dog. No excentricities - he was just always there to make everyone feel safe. At night, he liked to reach out with his hand and have you hold it while you sat on the couch. It made him feel happy that people acknowledged him that way.

Well - anyways. That's about all for Charlie. If you could find a second to say a prayer to the dog-gods or channel some warmth his way, I'm sure he'd appreciate it as the world closes on him.

Thanks,

Pete

[Andy Turnbull]

He sounds blessed to have lived to a ripe old age and I shall certainly spare a thought and send some love his way.

Andy

[legios]

He sounds like he is a fine specimen of dog-dom. I shall certainly channel some kind thoughts Charlies way.

Karl

[The Doctor]

nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggghhhhhhhh.

-Ralph

[Hero]

Channeling/Praying all the way.

[grahamthomson]

Both myself and Coben are channeling for some peace for Charlie. And as Andy said, he's been very lucky to have reached such an age. I'm sure he's had a wonderful life with you as his owner.

[dyrl]

Thanks guys.

He's a tough dog. Still kicking. I don't know why last night was so bad, but he was really almost a gonner. Some more heart medication helped though, as well as a double dose of this stuff which cleans the water out of his lungs and... well - he slept and this morning was happy to go outside and run around in the snow.

Got tired real fast though; but still - very obviously happy to go running around in the morning; even if he only had the strength to do it for like 15 minutes.

As a side note - I don't know what you guys think of euthenising/putting to sleep animals to cut short their suffering, but would be curious to hear some opinions.

My own view (anti-euthinizing) isn't dogmatic, but rather stemps from the very reason that lots of folks who are pro-euthenization give: namely empathy, a desire to "cut short" suffering. The way I see it - being alive is better than being dead, and enjoying life even if it hurts sometimes, is better than feeling nothing.

It wasn't an easy choice to make, because I see that sometimes he does really suffer and there's not much you can do. But - every time I see him get up and go running around and wag his tail - then I'm glad I didn't put him to sleep because it would have been wrong.

I guess what I'm getting at is this: sometimes I think that people tend to support euthanization not because they want to cut short the suffering of those who are dying - but because they want to cut short THEIR OWN suffering. They don't like to idea that day in and day out someone they know is suffering and so they make up this notion that they've got to be humane and cut short this person's pain... when in fact, the only one who "feels better" is the living - who don't have to remain helpless in the face of suffering.

This view of mine is reinforced as I watch my dog: there were times when it was really bad - but even then, it was obvious he was happy to be suffering in my company and happy to say goodbye. And then - we never can predict when death will come - like yesterday - I thought he was a gonner - but today he was out enjoying the crisp winter air.

If I'd called the vet to come put him to sleep yesterday - that would have been bad given how happy he was today.

These are just my opinions. I know that in certain cases (for instance a horse with a broken leg or humans who are paralyzed) it's not as clear cut - that is - there is no way for them to "somtimes" still enjoy life - but even then, so long as the consciousness functions... there is hope...they can dream or think...

What do people think?

Pete

[Shockprowl]

Phew, well, all I can say is that when we had to have our family dog put down many many years ago, she was very old, and very unwell, and the thing which decided it for us was the fact that she doesn't understand. She was unwell, and she had no way of understanding why. So in the end it was the kindess thing to do. Sad stuff, sorry Pete.

Anyway, sounds like there ain't been many a dog that's had as happier life.

[grahamthomson]

Unfortunately it's very difficult to approach this kind of thing logically without coming across as cold and possibly heartless.

For me, it should all be about balance. Life, as it is, is normally full of trials and hardships, that's a given. But it's how that bad is balanced with the good that matters. If the pain/suffering outweighs the happiness by a great margin, then it's time to, well, you know.

And if I may lighten the mood; I also use that same principle when thinking about ending a relationship!

[Deleted]

My family's pet dog was put to sleep at the beggining of last year due to her developing a tumour. We had three options: we could put her down and end the suffering of both her and us seeing her suffer, we could have given her an operation to remove the tumour but, because she had already had an operation to remove a previous tumour about six months beforehand a second operation could have killed her or we could have let her die naturally and in obvious pain. In the end we decided to have her put down as we all felt that was the best thing for her. She had lived for sixteen years which we all felt was a good age for a dog anyway.

[dyrl]

Sorry to hear it Zudobug - it's almost as though all happy stories have sad endings... Charlie isn't suffering horribly at this point - he's breathing heavily and when he sleeps...well - it's amazing - but he just...sleeps - you need to literally shake him to get him to wake up... But when he's up, he still goes outside, he likes getting sausages to eat or other meaty treats, and he wags his tail and likes being petted. I know he's also suffering and getting worse day in and day out - and the medication to keep his heart going cost a ton of money - but... the way I see it - if there's even a chance for one more good moment, he should have it.

The balance thing...sounds good - but the problem I personally have is making the decision. Technically, so long as one breathes there is hope that there will be another good moment. By arbitrarily deciding "well - now you die" - we cut off the potential for that good moment that might have been just round the corner. I know we also cut off the potential for big or greater suffering... but... for me...it's a bit of a "so what?" kind of thing. I think only in the case of imminent near death where the suffering is agonizing intolerable could I consider cutting it short - but even then I'd hesitate because I firmly believe my dog would be happy just seeing me another the other dogs who are his best friends around him as he is dying...to cut him off from that unnaturally...I don't think I could...

And if I may lighten the mood; I also use that same principle when thinking about ending a relationship!

Graham: Well sweetheart - our relationship has come to the point that I can safely compare it to a dying dog who has two choices: either it dies in agonizing pain for a long time or it dies now because we euthenize it. Choose.

?

You're a harsher man towards women than even I

Thank you everyone for your channeling!

Charlie apparently heard you and decided to live a bit longer. He's still doing "fine"

Pete

[The Doctor]

All the best for Charlie!

-Ralph

[dyrl]

Thanks everybody for your channeling. It worked.

Charlie died this morning of heart failure - five months after I opened this thread.

The vets gave him two weeks of life and told me to put him to sleep.

I didn't believe that and started giving Charlie heart medication and medication for blood pressure - just like you'd give your grandfather or grandmother if she were ill.

The vets also said he had lung cancer, but I didn't believe that either.

Needless to say - his lungs were strong and healthy up to the moment he died.

A week ago, he became pretty much paralyzed from the waiste down. I had to carry him back and forth so he could get his toiletries out of the way; although there was one time when he managed to walk an entire 20 meters with me egging him on.

Other than the last two weeks, he spent the last few months running around - maybe not as fast as usual, maybe not as far as usual - but running, exploring, frolicking in the grass and the forrest.

He was still alive this morning when I got up. I was going to give him breakfast - but unfortunately he was dead when I returned. His heart was still beating a little bit though, and I opened his eyes and would like to think he saw me before his heart stopped beating permanently.

We burried him in the backyard and made a tombstone for him. He will be missed.

Lesson from all of this?

Don't put your dogs or cats to sleep when the vet says it's time. It's not.

Charlie lived about 5 months out of which 4 and a half were normal healthy running and playing dog months - and the last two weeks were full of care from his owner - so not once did he feel bad; or so I'd like to think - because at every step he was taken care of.... carrying a huge st. bernard around ain't easy though, I can tell you that...

Anyways.

RIP Charlie.

and thanks Hub for the channeling.

Pete

[blueshift]

Sorry to hear of your loss

[Andy Turnbull]

Sorry to hear that Pete. I'm glad that Charlie got a few more months of life and fun.

Hope you are holding up okay.

Andy

[Hero]

Sorry to hear about Charlie. I'm glad for you he was bought some more time.

I certainly know what you mean with the lesson described. Cats Protection warned me the same thing in that some vets operate more as a business venture rather than medical care. I almost lost my own two pets way too early from the '£ sign in thier eyes' judgement of Hycroft.

Stay in touch Pete. If there's anything/channeling you want, do ask.

===KEN

[grahamthomson]

Very sorry to hear that, Pete. He'll be happy you were with him at the end.

[Deleted]

Sorry to hear of the loss Pete.

[The Doctor]

I am sorry to hear of Charlie's passing.

-Ralph

[grahamthomson]

Coben got an extra spoonful of olive oil on his dinner and a Jumbone this evening. We dedicated it to Charlie.

[Deleted]

When my family's dog was put down we decided that it was the best for her because she was in visible pain and she had a large abscess on her side. I sympathize with people who think that an animal should die naturally but in some cases it is best to have her put down.

[legios]

I am sorry to hear that Charlie has passed on, it is a great shame.

Karl

[Shockprowl]

Sorry Pete.x

[kayevcee]

Condolences, Pete!

-Nick

[dyrl]

Thanks guys for all the support and again thanks big time for the channeling - I'm positive it helped Charlie not only live longer, but keep his strength up for most of the ordeal.

As a side note - I don't mean to imply that I think vets are bad or "out for profit" even if it means killing the dog. In fact, the vet who suggested putting him to sleep made tons mor money because of my decision to keep him alive. Heart medicine and various other medication for Charlie cost a heck of a lot of money over the last five months.

Instead, I think the vet's suggestion was a case of country dog versus city doctor.

If Charlie - who was a st. bernard (aka huge massive dog) lived in a small flat in the city, he probably would have died in two weeks like the vet said.

But Charlie lived his entire life on the farm, running free at light speed. He also spent his last months of life there. These conditions helped keep him healthy and alive longer for sure.

The vet is from the city, he's used to treating dogs who live in more confined conditions and therefore have worse health due to lack of movement (no amount of walks can beat just letting the dog run around for hours on end).

Thanks again,
Pete

[Deleted]

I'm glad to hear that Charlie at least had a wonderful quality of life.