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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 28, 2010 16:21:56 GMT
Picked it up at lunchtime, the Nick cover naturally. Cover's great, though shame none of the original Wreckers are on it. Could've been room for the Jumpstarters. No other complaints though. Read it with a bottle of beer and the soundtrack to a Michael Bay film about a commando unit going to liberate a prison taken over by bad guys on in the background. First surprise for me, only because I haven't been paying attention, is that Nick has sole script credit, while the story credit is shared with Jim. But maybe you all knew that was the arrangement. Anyhow! One thing stands out about this issue for me which is a huge plus point - it took me a good while to read! I can't remember the last time a new TF comic took me so long to get through. It's not just the word count, it's also the time spent appreciating the story information in the artwork. Well, it wasn't such a good thing that I had to spend a long time looking at panel 3 on page 4 before I worked out what was going on (it was ages before I noticed the guy in the background and realised that the Autobot didn't have four legs - I blame the colourist), but nearly every other panel in the comic is worth spending oodles of time over to make sure you've got all the goodness out of it. The first five pages are like the action set piece at the start of a blockbuster movie - for example, the Shanghai sequence in ROTF. It has lots of explosions and killing in it, which sets the tone, not for the whole story, but no doubt for the climax later on. As such, they might not be a good choice for Internet preview pages, since they contain little characterisation. I hope no-one was put off buying it by reading those pages on-line and deciding it would be too exhausting to read a comic in that tone from cover to cover. However, taken as the attention-grabbing opening of the whole comic, they are spot on. Alas, poor Skyquake! I pity people who own the toy. Has any other toy character in TF comic history 'died'* so quickly after being introduced?
*I've seen TFs recover from worse.
Is it just me, or is Overlord somewhat on the camp side? I imagine him speaking with the voice of Q from Star Trek. "Oh, your puny imaginations are so limited, you poor, poor mortals!"
Next we jump forward in time and meet the Wreckers' new recruits. The scene is played for laughs, with most of them being shown as somewhat destructive anti-establishment types with up-yours attitudes. Not exactly professional soldier material, which is what I'd want in my commando unit. Still, Pyro seems decent enough, trying to put out the fires and apologise to the poor official who I think Nick based on the sleeping sentry outside the goblin city in 'Labyrinth'. But the other three remind me of the clumsy Triple Changers from 'Cold Comfort and Joy' who 'fell on some buildings'. Pyro's a bit wishy-washy with all his apologies when he should be disciplining his companions. And Rotorstorm is in my bad books for hating the goblin guy. I guess they all have a lot of growing up to do as the series progresses!
Then... "By the sacred spires! A human!"
Rotorstorm gets some points back for his line, "Ultra Magnus has shrunk." Nice.
Dunno who this Verity is, and I'm not mad keen on the stylised way humans are drawn in modern comics, but I am pleased to see a human in this series, for the reason I always give - having humans in your TF story makes the TFs big and impressive where they would otherwise be just guys in robot suits. Here's hoping we get to see a lot of alien TF stuff from a human perspective later in the story. I had previously been resigned to seeing everything through TFs' eyes. Only problem is, she seems to be taking TFs in her stride, so maybe the novelty has worn off for her. We don't really look up at the robots towering over her. But that may change as her character is fleshed out at a later stage.
Cut back to the prison planet. The surviving Predators aren't big Overlord fans. Reminds me of the Triggercons muttering in the background in 'The Fall and Rise of the Decepticon Empire', while Legonis, Octus and Seizer entertain their idle followers with gladiatorial spectacles. But there's a difference here, in that Overlord appears to have a hidden purpose, as if he is seeking to recruit the strongest fighters to his side, even when they start out as Autobots. But if he's so smart that he can turn Autobots bad, why is he blind to the rebellious thoughts of the Predators? Time will tell, whether they repeat the Triggercons' coup and turn on their master, or whether Overlord is smarter than the Triumvirate and makes events follow a different course.
Cut back to the Wreckers. Ironfist is a Wrecker groupie. Doesn't help my doubts about the newbies being professional commando material, but does give him personality. His enthusiastic speech panel is very expressively drawn by Nick.
Nice to have references to Roadbuster and TMUK. (I actually thought it said J'Muk to begin with, a character mentioned by name in 'City of Fear'!) What has happened to Roadbuster, anyone? I'm sure I saw him in an earlier comic drawn by Nick. Hope Whirl and Rack'n'Ruin also get mentioned along the way...
Then we have the reference to Impactor. Now, I absolutely loved this reference the first time I read it, as I thought it was a throwaway homage to the Marvel character. I quite liked the idea of Impactor just being a 'name' in the IDW comics, that would conjure up thoughts of the guy who died saving a wily old buzzard and then again saving Cybertron from nuclear obliteration. 'Twould have been a respectful nod, to speak in hushed tones of the Wreckers' original leader, who is no more. Hooray! They mentioned him!
But... then he appears in the final splash page, alive and not entirely well, much as he did as a zombie robot in 'Legion of the Lost'. On my first reading, this didn't read well, because it came too quickly after the reference to him, and made the reference that I thought was a subtle homage look more like a shoehorned plot set-up. Then I re-read the earlier bit and understood that the reference to Impactor was because he was imprisoned on the planet they are heading towards, which made it a bit better.
BUT
You guys are being very brave indeed. You've brought back to life again a character who has had _two_ of the finest deaths of a character in TF comic history. OK, Scrounge's was better, but Impactor pulled it off _twice_. Optimus Prime has been killed and brought back so many times that it doesn't mean anything any more. After the first few times, you stopped worrying about it.
So, Impactor. Like I say, brave. I dunno if anyone can bring him back to life again and make it add to rather than diminish the character, but you may pull it off, depending on how you treat him. Bring on #2! I'm hooked. Martin
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Post by Bogatan on Jan 28, 2010 17:17:50 GMT
I think I agree with everything you said. For me the best thing was (barring the odd panel) being able to understand what I was looking at. After working through 5+ IDW trades in the last few months I've become used to staring at art that looks pretty but is near impssible to understand.
Question - Page 4 first panel who is the guy in the air shooting? It looks like a G1 style Animated Starscream to me, but I'm probably missing a more obvious cameo. I'm probably missing plenty more.
Great last page and profile.
Andy
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Post by Bogatan on Jan 28, 2010 17:21:49 GMT
Another thing, the preview says *2 regular covers will be shipped in a 1-to-1-to-1 ratio.
1-to-1 I get, but 1-to-1-to-1?
I got the last of the Nick covers this afternoon, but there were another 5 or more of coverB, if shops are getting equal numbers then I think Nicks covers are popular.
Andy
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 28, 2010 17:30:23 GMT
Just edited my first post with the new stuff in spoiler tags. Question - Page 4 first panel who is the guy in the air shooting? It looks like a G1 style Animated Starscream to me, but I'm probably missing a more obvious cameo. I think most of the cameos are from the 1992-3 European toy ranges. For example, the Trakkon Fearswoop appears on page 11. Martin
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Post by jamesr on Jan 28, 2010 23:23:11 GMT
First surprise for me, only because I haven't been paying attention, is that Nick has sole script credit, while the story credit is shared with Jim. But maybe you all knew that was the arrangement. Anyhow! Firstly, glad you liked the issue! Point taken about Impactor -- interesting to hear what you think as the series progresses, because he wasn't brought back just to titillate TFUK fans... Secondly - just so there's no confusion - I was brought in at the story outline stage. Nick and I worked on the whole story together. I contributed a little to the script in issue one, but nothing to warrant a co-writer credit. From issue two onwards it is a truly collaborative effort, and the credits in future issues will reflect this.
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Post by Bogatan on Jan 29, 2010 0:10:03 GMT
Just edited my first post with the new stuff in spoiler tags. Question - Page 4 first panel who is the guy in the air shooting? It looks like a G1 style Animated Starscream to me, but I'm probably missing a more obvious cameo. I think most of the cameos are from the 1992-3 European toy ranges. For example, the Trakkon Fearswoop appears on page 11. Martin Yeah missed that one as well, I don't know why. I noticed Nick mentioned Mudflap and skids being the bots decapitated by Snare in the next panel (page 4 panel 2) so if movie characters ar there maybe it is Ani Starscream. Can't think of any one else with a similar design particularly the flip out guns on hte forearms. Andy
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 29, 2010 7:15:09 GMT
Firstly, glad you liked the issue! Point taken about Impactor -- interesting to hear what you think as the series progresses, because he wasn't brought back just to titillate TFUK fans... I'm glad to hear that. I think more of you guys than to believe you would bring him back gratuitously just to have a splash page with him on it and then waste him in a minor throwaway role that could have been filled just as well by a lesser character! Ah, excellent! I look forward to seeing an increased Roberts influence from this point forwards! Thanks, James. Martin
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primenova
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Post by primenova on Jan 29, 2010 10:10:01 GMT
Going by what Martin states in the first post - & also linking to the Tales Ravage story.
Just think ...
how good a 'nuff said style issue by Nick would be?
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Post by blueshift on Jan 29, 2010 10:45:47 GMT
Am I the only one who hates silent issues?
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primenova
Fusilateral Quintro Combiner
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Post by primenova on Jan 29, 2010 12:20:16 GMT
Just think of the jokes Nick would put in the issue - Ravage sneaking around a Autobot base or human base looking though air vents.
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 29, 2010 17:51:04 GMT
Am I the only one who hates silent issues? No, you're not. Speech, narrative captions, thought balloons, they all add extra dimensions to the story for me. If a character is on his own, bring on the thought balloons please. Martin
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Post by charlesrocketboy on Jan 29, 2010 18:57:14 GMT
The issue turned out today and IT WAS TOTALLY WICKED.
Lashes of violence! Obscure characters doing stuff! Verity and her tits! An extremely nasty villain! Plot set-ups! A Wreckers fanboy! A final page that I NEVER saw coming and made me exclaim out loud!
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Jan 29, 2010 19:33:27 GMT
This is indeed a Mighty Comic. Good work James and Nick. Pleased to see that responsibility for FM's fate can be left at Nick's door. You swine.
Loved the Impactor nod, thought it was a good touch... thought Thunderwing when the Decepticon ship was exploding... turned the page.... DAMN YOU BOTH!! It is not good to squeal like a school girl in a public coffee shop.
I'm enjoying the set up and the characters are oozing personality and ambition already, very engaging.
And would echo Martin's comment on the length of time to read it, so meaty!! Can't wait to find another day free to go through it again.
Great work and thanks guys! Best Transformers comic in decades if not ever!
Gavin ---------
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Post by Kingoji on Jan 30, 2010 17:52:37 GMT
Love it. The rest of IDW's writing team should pay heed. Structure, depth, strong characterization, history, set ups, introductions, reintroductions, reinventions, all LOOKING like TransFormers with not a single thing feeling forced. This is how comics should be made. Massive splash panels/pages/spreads muliple times in a single issue with page after page with enough dialogue to fill one half is very much not. The way to make comics, I mean. I'm lookin' at YOU, MacCarthy! We even had characters being vague about details and it wasn't annoying. Know why? Because these guys will either explain it later, or credit the reader with intelligence enough to work it out for themselves. For example, they were vague about the guy in the cliffhanger, but that will no doubt be explained. They were also vague about the history of OVERLORD, and I very much doubt that we'll learn the details in the series. But that doesn't matter, because we've already learned enough about the kind of guy he is for it to not be uber important.
Roll on issue two, and Wreckers Rule!
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 30, 2010 19:11:22 GMT
The high quality of the comic so makes me wish that the mini-series was commissioned to be a story set in the Marvel TF universe (which it could have been, since IDW are in the business of printing comics set in the Marvel TF universe, namely all those reprints) and not a reboot universe that I have no interest in. But then no comic company with any sense should pay attention to the wishes of someone like me who doesn't have any intention of buying its comics unless they're made by people I know personally. I have visited the IDW discussion forum for the first time ever to read what IDW regulars think of the issue, and I'm really pleased with how well it's going down. Apart from sharing their enthusiasm for the series though, it's clear that what I like about it differs a fair bit from what people who follow the IDW series in general like about it. They seem to love, for example, the way in which the Transformers are written as regular guys, and the way the human treats them as nothing particularly out of the ordinary - like the way TF fans are accustomed to think of TFs after years of exposure to them. Quite the opposite from my preferences, where the whole appeal of TFs is in their being a different sort of life-form to us and mindblowingly impressive... and where I lose interest when the TFs cease to be portrayed as alien and unusual. Another example of how we differ is the way IDW regulars get a kick from every old TF character that shows up (at least in name and appearance) in the new universe. It shouldn't surprise me, because if you _didn't_ get a kick from seeing new versions of old characters in a new universe you wouldn't be following the IDW comic in the first place. I still can't quite get my head around it though. A reader likes a character presumably because of who that character is as a person and the stories built around them... so when those lives are erased and you start from scratch, keeping only the name, rough shape and colour scheme... does anything remain of what it was you liked about that character in their previous life? If the new character had a different name and colour scheme, would that make it any more or less the 'same' character? Suppose for instance Nick and James had not called Springer's former leader Impactor, and had made him a blue and green Autobot instead of a purple and yellow one - but changed nothing else about 'The Last Stand of the Wreckers'. Would it be an inferior character, because its name and colour scheme are no longer based on a character from the Marvel TF universe? No, of course not. It would be exactly the same character that they had before they flipped the name and colour scheme, because a name and colour scheme don't make a character. It's the character's story that makes the character. Prowl in IDW isn't the same character as was called Prowl in the Marvel run, because that Prowl was a guy who crashed on the Ark, woke up in 1984, led the Autobots to rescue Prime's head from Shockwave, got splinter-grenaded by Shrapnel, etc., etc. Different guy. Prowl in IDW is some other guy, who may superficially resemble the Marvel Prowl, but because he has a completely different life it would be more honest of the writers to call him Logicore and make him yellow and red... 'cos he's a different person. So, if a character I liked in one continuity gets his name and general appearance recycled by Dreamwave, IDW or whoever comes next, I'm not getting excited about them showing up because it's a different guy. Don't get me wrong, I love to see pictures of Prowl, or Impactor, or whoever, drawn by someone as talented as Nick (because I liked those Marvel characters), and I love to see a good story about a bunch of new guys written by someone as talented as James. But I don't get that extra buzz from finding that the name and look of a Marvel TF character has been re-used for a new guy that has some things in common with him, in a new universe. This new guy - called Impactor in this case - has to, and no doubt will in this series, justify his place in the story from scratch. When I reached this stage in my thinking it suddenly occurred to me that I had fallen into the trap of thinking of this IDW Impactor as the Marvel Impactor. The Marvel Impactor was a guy who died in every story he appeared in, in an era when toy characters tended to live and non-toy characters tended to die. For the last 48 hours I have been wondering how James and Nick plan to kill Impactor in their story and be original... because Impactor always dies, and is a non-toy character from an era when non-toy characters die. Then it suddenly occurred to me: Why am I assuming this Impactor has to die? This is no longer an era when toy characters always live and non-toy characters die, and this isn't the guy Simon Furman invented solely for the purposes of killing off. This is James and Nick's guy. They could have called him Rev-Tone. If they had, I wouldn't be assuming he was doomed to die, so why am I assuming he is doomed to die because they've called him Impactor? What's in a name? God, I'll be so chuffed and impressed if the mini-series sticks its tongue out at me for making assumptions, and has Impactor roll off untroubled into the sunset at the end after all the toy characters have made their Last Stand. Martin
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Post by blueshift on Jan 30, 2010 19:37:44 GMT
I just want to say, after all the build up and excitement, I was thinking this comic would HAVE to be a bit of a disappointment, nothing could live up to that much hype. How awesome it was to be totally wrong! Wreckers pretty much proves that the Marvel UK school of TF comics (lots of plot, lots of imagination and lots of new interesting characters) is the way to go! Take heed IDW!
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Post by Kingoji on Jan 30, 2010 21:24:12 GMT
Because this book is so awesome, I have decided to bring it down a notch for myself by reading OVERLORD's lines with X the Eliminator's voice in mind.
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 31, 2010 7:43:12 GMT
Because this book is so awesome, I have decided to bring it down a notch for myself by reading OVERLORD's lines with X the Eliminator's voice in mind. Try reading it while imagining all the characters talk like they've been inhaling helium. Martin
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Post by Kingoji on Jan 31, 2010 16:52:56 GMT
So... was that Longtooth?
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Post by dinogrrl on Feb 1, 2010 4:18:35 GMT
Well then. Terribly busy week and could only get to the shop on Friday. Of course, the bloke whips out both covers and asks me which one I wanted.
Wait, I have to choose between a Roche and a Hutch cover? Bollocks to that, I said, and bought the both of them. And thus my local comic shop was now bereft of LSoTW.
I haven't had the chance to write a proper review, but I have to say I was impressed from cover to cover. I was nervous that it was going to give me angst and heartburn, like much of AHM did, but no such thing! I was left happy and fairly bouncing around for Issue 2.
Verity's appearance is still a little jarring given what I last remember her looking like (back in Infiltration) but I like that she's been given solid role being assistant to Magnus. And the implication that she ended up there because she snuck onboard as a stowaway at first.
I never thought that I'd give a rats bottom about the 'other Wreckers' but bugger it if this issue hasn't already made me like Pyro. He's so dorkily cute with Verity and kinda incapable of controlling his buddies. Ironfist is close behind in the new favourites race, with his fanboy nerdiness.
And that last bloody page. Even with the name dropping earlier in the issue, I never even suspected that. My first reaction to that was to yell "You cheeky bastard!", and yes, that is aimed in your direction, Nick.
The little profile piece in the back is neat and I assume the rest of the new Wreckers will get similar profiles through the rest of the issues.
Overlord is camp violence incarnate. I keep thinking of some upper crusty Bond villain type voice for him.
Most of all I love the personalities that came through in this issue. This sort of lively characterization has been lacking for a while, and is part of what puts me off the ongoing. LSoTW more than makes up for that, in great bombastic style.
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Post by Kingoji on Feb 1, 2010 6:25:04 GMT
OVERLORD is camp violence incarnate. I keep thinking of some upper crusty Bond villain type voice for him. X the Eliminator!
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Post by The Doctor on Feb 1, 2010 13:05:51 GMT
This has been a hard post to write.
I have enormous respect for the creative team on this title. I am genuinely thrilled to see James Roberts get a professional writing gig and Nick Roche has put out some great comics and is an all-round thoroughly decent chap.
And so I have to be completely honest and admit this is not the comic for me. I'm just not keen on the violence at the start and I had to stop reading at the page where Maximus is tossed to a rabid hoard and bodily fluid splatters up in the next panel. Too gory for my taste and pretty horrible. I was repulsed by the scene and could not read on. Therefore I cannot fully judge the comic as a whole, alas. I'm not a prude. I'm seen more violent stuff in other comics before and there is an element of double standards as I've written fanfic with stuff like that in it. But it just didn't sit well with me. It just pushed my button.
I wish the guys all the best for this title and I hope it is a roaring success as the team deserve a hit comic series. I honestly hope it pans out well and I am genuinely delighted to see it getting such a positive reaction. What I read was well crafted. It just wasn't my cup of tea.
-Ralph
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Feb 1, 2010 15:57:42 GMT
The ending seemed a bit awkward to me as my thinking on Impactor was like Martin's, but a great start. Lot's happening in this issue which is good and it looked gorgeous too. The new guys amuse me and I hope to see more Autopedia pages. I liked having Verity back as well - I assume the Alien tattoo is in remembrance of Hunter.
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Post by Bogatan on Feb 1, 2010 16:57:50 GMT
This has been a hard post to write. I have enormous respect for the creative team on this title. I am genuinely thrilled to see James Roberts get a professional writing gig and Nick Roche has put out some great comics and is an all-round thoroughly decent chap. And so I have to be completely honest and admit this is not the comic for me. I'm just not keen on the violence at the start and I had to stop reading at the page where Maximus is tossed to a rabid hoard and bodily fluid splatters up in the next panel. Too gory for my taste and pretty horrible. I was repulsed by the scene and could not read on. Therefore I cannot fully judge the comic as a whole, alas. I'm not a prude. I'm seen more violent stuff in other comics before and there is an element of double standards as I've written fanfic with stuff like that in it. But it just didn't sit well with me. It just pushed my button. I wish the guys all the best for this title and I hope it is a roaring success as the team deserve a hit comic series. I honestly hope it pans out well and I am genuinely delighted to see it getting such a positive reaction. What I read was well crafted. It just wasn't my cup of tea. -Ralph Those first few pages are pretty violent, but I wouldn't say they are representative of therest of the comic. On the other hand they could be representative of the series as a whole. Andy
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2010 19:02:51 GMT
You get that in comics sometimes. A person is looking forward to a title and then when it comes out disappointment sets in. To be fair I'm not giving my opinion on it until I've read it myself but the preview pages posted earlier didn't it well with me either. I still however expect it to be better than some of IDW's other recent TF output.
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Feb 1, 2010 19:15:44 GMT
I'm just not keen on the violence at the start and I had to stop reading at the page where Maximus is tossed to a rabid hoard and bodily fluid splatters up in the next panel. Too gory for my taste and pretty horrible. I was repulsed by the scene and could not read on. Therefore I cannot fully judge the comic as a whole, alas. I'm not a prude. I'm seen more violent stuff in other comics before and there is an element of double standards as I've written fanfic with stuff like that in it. But it just didn't sit well with me. It just pushed my button. That's interesting. That's pretty much the way I feel about Marvel's TF G2 comic, but not this one (not this issue, at any rate). Maybe it's partly because I don't find the artwork ugly (as I did G2's), and partly that only a couple of people die in the issue (and for good story reasons rather than randomly) - as opposed to G2's wholesale slaughter. I dunno - I'd say this was much less gory and horrible than G2... ...and less violent than a lot of James' TMUK stories. I also like to think that this 'Fortress Maximus' is not only still alive, but switched himself off before he got tossed to the prisoners. Robot, after all. (Ooh! Ooh! Or maybe the bodily fluid spattering up isn't Max's, but belongs to all the Decepticons whose asses he's whupping! ) But there's no correct or incorrect taste, and I can certainly identify with your reaction Ralph, since I had the same to a different set of comics. And the series could get nastier as it goes on. Martin
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Post by jamesr on Feb 1, 2010 19:45:44 GMT
This has been a hard post to write. I have enormous respect for the creative team on this title. I am genuinely thrilled to see James Roberts get a professional writing gig and Nick Roche has put out some great comics and is an all-round thoroughly decent chap. And so I have to be completely honest and admit this is not the comic for me. I'm just not keen on the violence at the start and I had to stop reading at the page where Maximus is tossed to a rabid hoard and bodily fluid splatters up in the next panel. Too gory for my taste and pretty horrible. I was repulsed by the scene and could not read on. Therefore I cannot fully judge the comic as a whole, alas. I'm not a prude. I'm seen more violent stuff in other comics before and there is an element of double standards as I've written fanfic with stuff like that in it. But it just didn't sit well with me. It just pushed my button. I wish the guys all the best for this title and I hope it is a roaring success as the team deserve a hit comic series. I honestly hope it pans out well and I am genuinely delighted to see it getting such a positive reaction. What I read was well crafted. It just wasn't my cup of tea. -Ralph Hey Ralph I was sorry to read that the first few pages put you off. Maybe later on you'll go back to find out what happened in the rest of comic, and maybe that'll persuade you to stick around for future issues. The pages you've read serve as a kind of pre-credits sequence to the story, and - much as I personally love 'em - don't necessarily reflect the following 100 pages. As the story unfolds, you'll see (or you MIGHT see, depending on whether you continue reading) that this is about more than action sequences. Nick and I made sure of that.
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Post by The Doctor on Feb 1, 2010 20:11:22 GMT
Thanks for your response. It's always nice to have polite interaction. If only more message boards could be so civil!
-Ralph
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Post by bertie on Feb 2, 2010 0:03:49 GMT
I love this place.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2010 11:43:32 GMT
At least we're getting some good reply's from the writers of the comic regarding the feedback we're posting here. We never that from the IDW boards do we?
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