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Post by Toph on Nov 15, 2014 22:35:03 GMT
Since Generations restarted, post DotM, it's been hugely hit and miss. Mostly miss, cranking out some of the worst toys ever made.
All three Beast Wars though have all been Masterpiece quality, though.
But Springer and Sandstorm have been the only great voyagers (besides rhinox). The rest have been mediocre at best (whirl), or downright terrible.
The deluxes for this year have been more hit than miss, but before this year, they've been terrible.
Stealth Bomber Megatron, Rattrap, Waspinator, skids, Armada Starscream, Jhiaxus, Crosscut, Orion Pax... All great.
Windblade and Tankor hit the Mediocre mark. Everything else is pure rubbish. Nightbeat included.
The Legends were a decent idea that were executed poorly, and look to become even more rubbish.
If you're going to bungle them that badly, then have the decency to make them in the deluxe range so they're a proper size and have a proper minicon.
The only good legend that works is skrapnel. And his minicon is one of the worst.
So yeah. Generations since the line relaunched has been total s**t, save for an occasional diamond in the rough.
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 16, 2014 18:15:55 GMT
Having owned every Generations toy put out by Hasbro this year I have to say it's been a pretty poor year So this year's deluxe Dreadwing - peg on weapon broken out of packet. Waspinator - good, but very wary as certain parts seem fragile Autobot Skids - fabulous but misassembled Goldfire - another poor deco on a poor mould. Armada Starscream - not too bad. Skywarp - second reuse long after they should have done him Mini-Con Assault Team - not bad either. Autobot Scoop - arms don't secure right to chest plate in vehicle mode Tankor - dreadful tank mode Rattrap - rat's sticking up ears and jazz hands ruin the robot mode. Problems transforming. Certain parts seem fragile. Crosscut - Good Jhiaxus - nice go but wrong colour. And I've lost a gun. Windblade - complete train wreck of a toy. Absoloute nightmare to TF into jet mode and get a stable toy Nightbeat - Surprisingly good considering previous version. Desperately needed proper gun though |
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Post by Bogatan on Nov 16, 2014 21:21:05 GMT
Economics are clearly shifting the goalposts on the designers, but for me at least they are making better toys now (on average) than at any other point during the Classics era. Which has now been going for as long as G1 ran in the US.  I just noticed. Anyway, yeah Classic Bumblebee compared to Gen Bumblebee makes me sad for the state of the newer toy, but Classic Starscream vs Armada Starscream, Waspinator and Rattrap vs Cheetor and Dinobot. Wheeljack and Jazz are still my faourite classic autobot cars and while Skids doesn't reach those levels I still rate more than the Universe Autobot cars. I'd put all the recent voyagers (even Blitzwing -like Shockprowl said, it might be buggered, but it seems like it was because they tried for too much) over most of the earlier voyagers. Classic Prime is the only one voyager and larger mould that has stood the test of time. Having owned every Generations toy put out by Hasbro this year I have to say it's been a pretty poor year So this year's deluxe Dreadwing - peg on weapon broken out of packet. Waspinator - good, but very wary as certain parts seem fragile Autobot Skids - fabulous but misassembled Goldfire - another poor deco on a poor mould. Armada Starscream - not too bad. Skywarp - second reuse long after they should have done him Mini-Con Assault Team - not bad either. Autobot Scoop - arms don't secure right to chest plate in vehicle mode Tankor - dreadful tank mode Rattrap - rat's sticking up ears and jazz hands ruin the robot mode. Problems transforming. Certain parts seem fragile. Crosscut - Good Jhiaxus - nice go but wrong colour. And I've lost a gun. Windblade - complete train wreck of a toy. Absoloute nightmare to TF into jet mode and get a stable toy Nightbeat - Surprisingly good considering previous version. Desperately needed proper gun though Dreadwing - still not opened, and I still havent opened Megatron from last year Waspinator - Not had any worries Autobot Skids - fabulous but misassembled first run, but I got he recent second run and it has no problems. Goldfire - another poor deco on a poor mould. Cant disagree, only bought it out of a combination of completism and for potential customising as I really like Nightbeat and goshooter. Armada Starscream - Absolutely love it, finally an Armada design given the sort of articulation and fun I wanted 12 years ago. Skywarp - Yeah not my favourite mould Mini-Con Assault Team - not bad either. Autobot Scoop - Can't remember if I have any issues with the arms. Tankor - dreadful tank mode - cant argue. Almost a fun robot mode is the best I can say about it. Rattrap - I do wish the ears folded flat otherwise as Jetty said it's masterpiece quality. Crosscut - Great colours. And really well applied for a change. Jhiaxus - nice go but wrong colour which works surprisingly well. Windblade - still not opened it, wasn't overly impressed when I tried Phils. Nightbeat - Surprisingly good considering previous version. Desperately needed proper gun though - Gave it Crosscuts longer one, looks much better now. I was saying to Andy at the Lego show that I was convinced that the designers seem to be using some toys as sacrificial lambs and transferring funds from them to other toys. Tankor and the various uses of the Bumblebee mould appear to be the 2 biggest victims. With Rattrap, Waspinator and Skids/Crosscut the big beneficiaries. Looking at that list further convinces me, it would also be a fair explanation of Nightbeats switch from Jazz to BB mould. I can imagine the Jazz mould putting the wave over budget in some way. |
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Jim
Thunderjet
Micromaster Backside Monitor
Now in glorious Ultra HD 4K
Posts: 4,930
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Post by Jim on Nov 16, 2014 21:46:51 GMT
Where Armada Starscream is concerned, I'd say they gave it a good sculpt, pretty good articulation (but still limited by modern standards) and absolutely left out the fun - fun is where Armada usually wins! At the very least they should have done a Universe Hot Shot and included a Mini-Con.
There are problems with Scoops arms, but not quite enough to overly detract from a solid mould. My main problem with Scoop is that in some ways he's overly faithful - he seems kind of uninspired. Toys like Springer, or going back to the beginning, Classics Mirage or BB give us a new take on them while capturing something of the essence of the originals. Scoop is a very Ronseal kind of update.
In terms of Classics Voyagers, I have almost the opposite opinion! For me Jetfire and Megatron are the stand outs, especially in terms of fun. Prime's arm kibble has always annoyed me, and the lower legs seem too bulky. My Henkei Prime will probably go in my next purge.
-Jim
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 16, 2014 22:17:08 GMT
Voyagers:
Doubledealer - same issues as Blitzwing but oddly in a way I admire them for trying this as it sort of make sense.
Rhinox - good, but the rubber parts make me very nervous. I don't see them lasting.
Whirl - the knees freak me out, Some VERY disturbing photos online. Stickers :-( and trhere's not a lot to it apart from it being Whirl.
Roadbuster - I like Roadbuster better. I think the configurable weapons is a great idea but the implementation is marred. It should have been 5mm pegs and holes to connect all the weapons, instead of some using pegs and some slots. One of the shoulders is distinctly dodgy too.
Sky Byte - better now I have the stand to use with the Shark mode. But the shark doesn't do much and the TF wasn't fun. He does look nice though.
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Post by KnightBeat on Nov 16, 2014 23:09:02 GMT
I agree that Windblade is fragile and difficult to pose, but I quite like her. The ability to plug her scabbard into her leg is brilliant and the transformation is surprisingly original, given that she's essentially a seeker. Give her a new head and she'd make a convincing pre-BW Terrorsaur.
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 16, 2014 23:24:27 GMT
The figure is fine, the jet is the problem
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Post by The Doctor on Nov 22, 2014 16:13:58 GMT
Had a shot of Phil's Roadbuster. It has all the problems of the current era of TF toys and yet it has a certain something. More of a nice display piece than toy though. Would buy it if it ever turned up at UK retail and I was reeking of booze at the time.
-Ralph
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 22, 2014 16:18:20 GMT
Unless Brainstorm gets a move on then Roadbuster will end up being toy of the year for me!
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Post by Shockprowl on Nov 22, 2014 17:32:02 GMT
Really?! Roadbuster your toy of the year?! I've not touched one, but studied him vastly on the intersnatch. He looks ok, but toy of the year?
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 22, 2014 17:41:31 GMT
Voyager of the year.
My toy of the years is somewhat smaller.
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Post by Shockprowl on Nov 22, 2014 17:52:37 GMT
Leme guess...
Swerve!
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Post by Philip Ayres on Dec 14, 2014 20:18:12 GMT
Never did happen did it? :-( |
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Post by Andy Turnbull on Dec 14, 2014 21:22:38 GMT
Battle Masters made it.
I saw it in John Lewis in Edinburgh yesterday.
Andy
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Dezzeh
Thunderjet
Wait, what?
Posts: 4,888
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Post by Dezzeh on Dec 14, 2014 22:34:30 GMT
Sure I saw them in Smyths on Saturday..
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Post by Philip Ayres on Dec 15, 2014 10:19:39 GMT
I meant the Generations deluxes!
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Post by Toph on Dec 15, 2014 17:22:30 GMT
Got my Brainstorm today.
Huge disappointment.
Too simplistic a transformation for $25 bucks. Arcana is so poorly executed, it'd have been better had they not bothered. A LOT of really weird design choices. And he's too big!
I may just stick with my Smart Robin.
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Post by Pinwig on Dec 17, 2014 21:53:21 GMT
I got Brainstorm today too. I haven't unboxed him yet, but I am impressed by the shape & proportions of the figure. I like the headsculpt, think it works well. Cost me a bit more than $25 though. £27 from Kapow. Quite keen to standhim nex tto Brainwave for a comparison.
I'm having a quick clean up of outstanding Thrilling 30 figures I want but don't have before the new stuff starts arriving in force, so I got Waspinator too. Great figure. It'd be a crime if that mini resurgence of Beast Wars characters stops at Rhinox, Waspie and Rattrap. All three of those have been crackers.
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Post by Pinwig on Dec 20, 2014 23:14:05 GMT
Wow is the neck messed up with Brainstorm. I had a good fiddle with him tonight, spent ages trying to release the head from the body but no matter what I did to that grey slide on the chest, the little latch in the neck just would not release it. In the end I gave up and very carefully prised the head off without the aid of the catch.
I like the ship mode, but it feels like there is an engine block missing behind the cockpit.
I see why the head connect is so complicated, to incorporate the flick down mechanism for the attributes panel, but really it would have been better if the head connected just using a clip, like the old Scramble City limbs. The mechanism is too complicated for the quality of the toy. I do like it though. But it's not going to beat Springer or Rhinox for the top spot in the Thrilling 30 Voyager best buys.
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Post by Toph on Dec 21, 2014 1:19:24 GMT
Not much good can be said about "The Thrilling Thirty," it's masterminds, or the new mold designers...
But damn did someone on that crew absolutely LOVE beast wars.
T30 was soooo hit and miss, but each one of the three BWs were MP quality and design.
And thank primus for that.
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Post by Pinwig on Dec 21, 2014 21:29:45 GMT
Looking for pluses on Brainstorm because I really dig the robot mode. So, hip ratchets, thigh swivels and ankle tilts make the legs very posable. I also like the double joints on the elbows. I'm sure these are design cues Hasbro is picking up from third parties. He's immensely more posable than the default favourites from this range like Springer and he also has no open hollows, which is something this line gets a lot of flack for. Particularly in the legs. I think the head sculpt is excellent too. Loads of fine detail.
That does go a long way against the negatives for me.
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Post by Pinwig on Feb 9, 2015 18:53:40 GMT
Yeah, "Generations: Combiner Wars" is an umbrella subtitle. Everything in generations will be released under this title. No different than Beast Machines: Battle for the Spark, Armada: Unicron Battles, and Prime: Beast Hunters, and whatever the rebranding was for Energon and Cybertron. People are getting too caught up on "combining." And IDW. Powerglide, Bombshell, Thundercracker, Thundercracker, Windcharger, and Huffer don't combine. And I don't expect every voyager will, either. I read it that Combiner Wars is the new subtitle for the Generations line, like Thrilling 30 was the last one and Fall of Cybertron the one before that. It's a chance for a brand refresh, a reboot. New packaging and new numbering. So Megatron may not combine, but he is part of the Combiner War. You don't have to combine to be part of the war. Edit - bah. Caught out by the not seeing there was another page thing again. I've just repeated what Crazy said. |
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Post by Toph on Feb 9, 2015 19:57:05 GMT
There is a difference. Fall of Cybertron was limited to a set of figures that were specifically part of or related to the videogame, and not a linewide rebranding.
It got a prominant display because they were trying to really push and promote the game, AND the tied in toys. Not everything released at the time was FoC or FoC branded, like Springer.
Lijewise, "Thrilling 30" was a promotional gimmick, not a rebranding. Things sold outside of Generations received that stupid monicker. Many platinum editions, and a few Masterpieces I believe were listed as T30.
(For the record I called it stupid based on hasbro's terrible execution that seemed to have no rhyme or reason. Metroplex was like THREE entries by himself. The retail version, and both con exclusives got individual entries.)
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Post by Pinwig on Feb 10, 2015 0:11:33 GMT
There is a difference. Fall of Cybertron was limited to a set of figures that were specifically part of or related to the videogame, and not a linewide rebranding. Is that right? I thought while the FoC branding was being used it covered all the Generations toys. Just like Combiner Wars now does. The line is 'Generations' and has been called that since 2010, I thought since FoC every 18 months or so it gets a new marketing identity to refresh its presence. In recent years that has seen the line expand because those identities are tied to other promotional properties, first the video game and then IDW's comics. There was a difference when it was more embryonic - for example when the War for Cybertron figures came out they absolutely were a subset of the larger Generations line as the Reveal the Shield figures were still coming out, but didn't FoC blanket replace everything once that came in? I believe they were though. Springer was Thrilling 30. He's not in a black flashed FoC box, he's in a white T30 one. He was in the first T30 Voyager wave, at which point no new FoC toys were coming out. Oh, unless you're talking about the GDO Springer? I don't count them as I have never worked out if they were official US Hasbro releases or Hasbro China imports. I see promotional gimmick and rebranding as the same thing in terms of what you're saying, and although the '30' logo appeared over several lines, it was only Generations that had the 'Thrilling' subtitle with it and the associated brand packaging. It may be a small difference, but it was distinct. No AoE figures I've got boxes for had 'Thrilling' 30 on them. Just the 30. The difference is the whole range celebrating 30 years, but Generations being called 'Thrilling 30' because the gimmick was that it would represent all the different eras over the 30 years. That's true, it was stupid. I agree it was confused, because the actual 30 toys in that numbered set did cross all the different lines, and ultimately it was a pointless numbering system. The logo for it also doesn't have 'Thrilling' in it, it's just a numbered set of toys that mark the anniversary. It also crossed continents too, and included a fair number of retailer and convention exclusives - so I think that was an idea that was trying to attract hardcore collectors. It wasn't part of a brand identity for retail toys in US toy shops. When you look at what those 30 toys actually do represent, it's a microcosm of the entirety of the Transformers range for 2013/14. If you had those 30 toys you would have something that represented everything Hasbro do worldwide, be it mass retail, con exclusive or retailer incentive toys. Except Rescuebots. That's not a brand identity, that's an attempt to fleece completist fans with an adhoc numbering system for the sake of it. |
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Post by Toph on Feb 10, 2015 0:55:14 GMT
Springer was not part of the thrilling 30. This is a list of all the T30 releases, from tf wiki tfwiki.net/wiki/Thrilling_30#30_special_toysThere were actually very few generations toys actually apart of it. More AoE than anything else. |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Feb 10, 2015 7:44:25 GMT
FOC is a rebranding of the Generations line, the Logo appears on the box  Confusingly Thrilling 30 does seem to refer to two different thing. There's the numbered toy range above tfwiki.net/wiki/Thrilling_30#30_special_toysThen there's the Generations sub range, which has the Thilling 30 Logo on it. tfwiki.net/wiki/Transformers:_Generations#Thrilling_30_.282013-2014.29So while Springer may not be part of Thrilling 30 numbered toy range, he is a Generations Thrilling 30 toy:  The Logo is on the box so it's a rebranding of the line. Even more confusingly Generations Thrilling 30 is also numbered, and some Generations Thrilling 30 toys are also in the numbered Thrilling 30 range. Hasbro's branding team could have thought this through a bit better..... |
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Post by Llama God on Feb 10, 2015 7:58:59 GMT
Yes, the whole "Thrilling 30" thing was a complete mess, and smacks of last minute desperation. However, at least they didn't celebrate an important anniversary by killing the line... (Oh, Joe...)
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Post by Pinwig on Feb 10, 2015 9:43:24 GMT
This is what I was saying. That numbered set of 30 toys was only referred to as 'Thrilling' by fan sites trying to categorise it. Look at the logo for the numbering:  It doesn't refer to Thrilling at all. It's just an arbitrary set of 30 assorted toys that reflect Hasbro's Transformers output; 30 toys representative of the whole range from 2013/14 to sum up output in the anniversary year. 'Thrilling' 30 is the Generations imprint, and only that. Anything else that came close just had a '30' logo on it without 'Thrilling' across the top to tie it into the anniversary:  It is messy and confusing, but then Hasbro don't seem to really care about that. In fact if I remember rightly, I'd need to get a box out to check, the wave numbering didn't reset between FoC and Thrilling 30. IIRC Springer was numbered Voyager Wave 3 on his box wasn't he? but the box was rebranded from FoC to Thrilling 30. |
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Post by The Doctor on Feb 10, 2015 17:51:05 GMT
*brain overheats and explodes*
-Ralph
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Post by Toph on Feb 11, 2015 19:58:22 GMT
So you're right.
Though I still think FoC was less a linewide refresh like Beast Hunters and Combiner Wars, and more them trying to capitalize on the game, and pointing out these items are related to the game.
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I just noticed. Anyway, yeah Classic Bumblebee compared to Gen Bumblebee makes me sad for the state of the newer toy, but Classic Starscream vs Armada Starscream, Waspinator and Rattrap vs Cheetor and Dinobot. Wheeljack and Jazz are still my faourite classic autobot cars and while Skids doesn't reach those levels I still rate more than the Universe Autobot cars. I'd put all the recent voyagers (even Blitzwing -like Shockprowl said, it might be buggered, but it seems like it was because they tried for too much) over most of the earlier voyagers. Classic Prime is the only one voyager and larger mould that has stood the test of time. 
