Generations 30th

[Pinwig]

You could be right. It came at a time when the Generations line was evolving and had less of a defined identity, but it's clear since FoC they've felt the need for a hook to tie it to, whether games or comics. The WfC toys weren't even branded as game tie ins.

It's interesting how the line has expanded since 2010, and I'd love to know what encouraged or allowed that to happen, or indeed why there was such a dramatic downsize from the 2009 Universe line to the 2010 Generations one. I'd read a book on that kind of thing.

[Philip Ayres]

Yesterday I produced a table showing the CW toys and their repaints.

I thought it might be interesting to look at the T30 toys too .... and it turns out it's VERY interesting!

Deluxe Original			Repaint		Remould		Total	Grand Total
1	Orion Pax	1					1	4
			Lio Convoy Nove Prime Galva Convoy	TFCC TFCC Botcon			3
2	Bumblebee	1	Goldfire BB Nightbeat	3 6			3	5
			Go Shooter Carzap	Japan Gen Exc TFCC SS			2
3	Megatron	1	Dreadwing	3			2	4
			Nike Megatron Krok	Exclusive TFCC SS			2
4	Trailbreaker	1	Hoist	2			2	3
			Lift Ticket	Botcon 2015			1
5	Thundercracker1	2	Skywarp	4			2	2
							0
6	Skids	3	Crosscut	6			2	4
			Rollbar Burnout	AoE Exclusive Botcon 2015			2
7	Waspinator	3					1	5
			Parasite with Ripper Mudfighter with Thrasher Storm Rider with Crusher Paralyzer with Buzzer	Botcon 2015 Botcon 2015 Botcon 2015 Botcon 2015			4
8	Starscream	4			Jhiaxus	6	2	4
			Skywarp Ramjet	TFCC TFCC			2
9	Centurion	4					1	1
							0
10	Scoop	4					1	3
			Roadblock Hound	TF Adventures Botcon 2015			2
11	Rattrap	5					1	2
			Packrat	Botcon 2015			1
12	Tankorr	5					1	1
							0
13	Windblade	6					1	3
			CH Windblade Slipstream	SDCC 2015 TF: Legends			2
14	Chromia2	7					1	2
			CH Chromia	SDCC 2015			1
15	Arcee	7					1	3
			CH Arcee Nightbird	SDCC 2015 TF: Legends			2
Voyager Original			Repaint		Remould		Total	Grand Total
1	Blitzwing	1	Double Dealer	3			2	3
			Starscream	Cloud			1
2	Springer	1			Sandstorm	2	2	4
			Rodimus Battletrap	Cloud Botcon 2015			2
3	Rhinox	3					1	1
							0
4	Whirl	4					1	2
			Shockwave	Cloud			1
5	Roadbuster	5					1	3
			Ironhide General Optimus Prime	Cloud Botcon 2015			2
6	Skybyte	6					1	2
			Hellwarp	Cloud			1
7	Brainstorm	7					1	1
							0

1-Thundercracker is a Repaint of FoC Starscream
2-Chromia is a Remould of Prime Arcee


MUCH less remoulding for a start. Much less non exclusive repaints than CW, but a similar number overall (62 here vs 57 there) thanks to some Club & Botcon use which has only just kicked off with Combiner Wars. I think you could put a very good argument for CW paying for the lack of inline repaints in T30.

NOTE: there may be some here I've missed. LMK if there is.

You want me to do Legends now don't you?

[Shockprowl]

You're freakin' awesome, Big Phil!

[kayevcee]

Ah, go on then. You know you love it

-Nick

[nevermore]

Since I don't want to clutter the sightings forum with more off-topic posts, I'd like to give a brief update that I saw some of the STL-imported Voyagers you goys got at UK retail at the German Amazon warehouse I work at. Specifically, I saw Sandstorm and Blaster.

So it would appear some German FBA sellers also got their stock from the ominous STL.

Phil, question: If you count Japanese exclusives, why don't you count Japanese standard releases? TakaraTomy's "Bumblebee Goldbug" is different from both Hasbro's Bumblebee and Hasbro's Goldfire.
tagoal.flxsrv.org/images_2013_02/TFGENEJ_BUMBLEBEE_GOLDBUG/_1200705.jpg
tagoal.flxsrv.org/images_2013_02/TFGENEJ_BUMBLEBEE_GOLDBUG/_1200707.jpg

The rest differ from their Hasbro counterprts on a case by case basis, but at least as far as I'm concerned, they deserve separate entries just for the sake of completeness. Any "there exists a Takara version which I count as the same item as the Hasbro version even though it's not identical" would be arbitrary.

[Pinwig]

Wow, that makes that figure look so much better! slightly darker yellow and a different coloured head and it's almost palatable.

[Philip Ayres]

Jul 22, 2015 22:24:03 GMT nevermore said:

Phil, question: If you count Japanese exclusives, why don't you count Japanese standard releases? TakaraTomy's "Bumblebee Goldbug" is different from both Hasbro's Bumblebee and Hasbro's Goldfire.

tagoal.flxsrv.org/images_2013_02/TFGENEJ_BUMBLEBEE_GOLDBUG/_1200705.jpg
tagoal.flxsrv.org/images_2013_02/TFGENEJ_BUMBLEBEE_GOLDBUG/_1200707.jpg

The rest differ from their Hasbro counterprts on a case by case basis, but at least as far as I'm concerned, they deserve separate entries just for the sake of completeness. Any "there exists a Takara version which I count as the same item as the Hasbro version even though it's not identical" would be arbitrary.

Interesting question.

I had forgotten that the BB was that different so the question then becomes is it different enough? And then the question comes at what point does it become different enough to be a new toy?

There's very few cases that I can think of where a Japanese version immediately says "this is a different toy" without being a new character. BW Tigatron is one, Micron Legend Shockwave (Tidalwave) is another.

I'll need to have a think about this as I think there might be a way of showing this information..... possibly a third line for each toy: Western Release, Japanese Release, Exclusive..... Or a column giving Japanese release number?

Hmmm. Some thought required.

In the meantime the repaint tables for CW & Legends have been updated with this week's new info.

[Philip Ayres]

Jul 22, 2015 22:24:03 GMT nevermore said:

Since I don't want to clutter the sightings forum with more off-topic posts, I'd like to give a brief update that I saw some of the STL-imported Voyagers you goys got at UK retail at the German Amazon warehouse I work at. Specifically, I saw Sandstorm and Blaster.

Which would be this case:

2013 wave 4r3: 2 x Sandstorm 1 x Blitzwing 1 x Blaster

B&M have had this case, the Entertainer have it on their website. If you've seen Sandstorm or Blitzwing this is where they came from.

tmukhub.proboards.com/post/197869/thread for a list of the Generations Voyager cases and if we've had them or not.

[Philip Ayres]

Until I looked at Nevermore's linked pictures of T30 BB above I never realised there was a tire moulded into the inner side of each foot!

[Toph]

Yep. That Bumblebee is one of the cheatiest TFs around.
False hood chest, fake tires. Think there's something else that escapes me.

If you haven't noticed, FoC Jazz/Sideswipe also has fake tires molded into his legs. (Which I totally don't get since the entire alt mode is a fantasy vehicle. Why make up fake vehicle parts?)

[nevermore]

Jul 24, 2015 20:54:11 GMT Philip Ayres said:

Until I looked at Nevermore's linked pictures of T30 BB above I never realised there was a tire moulded into the inner side of each foot!

And it's only the outline of a fake tire, too! The entire foot is hollow.

Jul 24, 2015 16:04:47 GMT Philip Ayres said:

There's very few cases that I can think of where a Japanese version immediately says "this is a different toy" without being a new character. BW Tigatron is one, Micron Legend Shockwave (Tidalwave) is another.

How about Hasbro Prime Cyberverse Legion Vehicon (black) vs. Vehicon from the TakaraTomy EZ Collection Decepticon Set (metallic purple)? There's even a regular black Japanese EZ Collection Vehicon that's nigh-on identical to the Hasbro version.

Meanwhile, Hasbro Beast Hunters Cyberverse Legion Air Vehicon (purple) vs. TakaraTomy EZ Collection Jet Vehicon (black)...

Also, how do "drastically different Hasbro-only color variants for toys sold as the same products" figure into all of this?

I'm thinking of Beast Wars Transmetal 2 Prowl (white/turquoise/red vs. black/blue/red) and Dinobot (bone-tan/purple vs. white/blue), or Beast Hunters Deluxe Windrazor (cream yellow/bright green/dark metallic purple vs. gray/gold/dark green/flat bright purple).

Also, to a lesser degree, 2007 Movie Legends Ratchet (forest green vs. lime green similar to the Voyager figure).

They were all sold as identical products. Worse, the European-only single packs of 2007 Movie "Allspark Power" Legends Jazz and Recon Barricade (sold outside the US as part of "Allspark Battles" two-packs with Bonecrusher and Cliffjumper, who were also given single releases in Europe) were sold as the same products as original 2007 Movie Legends Jazz and Barricade!

Meanwhile, stuff like the 2001 RID "Super"/"new style" redecos of Deluxe Prowl, Side Burn and X-Brawn, or Cybertron red vs. yellow Scrapmetal, was sold as different products.

Hasbro is weird.

[Toph]

I think some of these examples such as the TM2s should count as running changes over full on repaints, or separate runs.

[nevermore]

Jul 24, 2015 16:14:03 GMT Philip Ayres said:

Jul 22, 2015 22:24:03 GMT nevermore said:

Since I don't want to clutter the sightings forum with more off-topic posts, I'd like to give a brief update that I saw some of the STL-imported Voyagers you goys got at UK retail at the German Amazon warehouse I work at. Specifically, I saw Sandstorm and Blaster.

Which would be this case:

2013 wave 4r3: 2 x Sandstorm 1 x Blitzwing 1 x Blaster

B&M have had this case, the Entertainer have it on their website. If you've seen Sandstorm or Blitzwing this is where they came from.

I can confirm this now: Saw Blaster, Blitzwing and four Sandstorms all in the same aisle, thus strongly implying they all came from the same shipment.

[dyrl]

So..is this the right place for me to write that Generations Skybite is probably the only case of a remould of a repaint of a remould into an "evil" faction from a "good" faction to achieve such popularity...except Scourge.

Of course the Triple Changers are ace, but the new mould for Skybite in Generations is great.

[Philip Ayres]

Previously unseen T30 Kup from Orion Pax

www.tfw2005.com/boards/threads/never-before-seen-generations-kup.1140805/

[Llama God]

Uh-huh.

[The Doctor]

Ah ha.

-Ralph

[Shockprowl]

Ho ho.



(I've no idea what the significance of this figure is, I just wanted to join in).

[Llama God]

I was mostly being cynical about Pete digging up yet another "exclusive"... (Or unreleased thing, yes I know. But I think yous all get my meaning by now.)

[Pinwig]

It's interesting looking back through this thread at the largely positive reaction Skids got. I never opened mine, most of my T30 figures never did (this may actually be the first Deluxe I've opened). I decided to last night on the grounds it looks like he's going to be missed out of the current series altogether and there's a Skids shaped hole in my 85 display.

Comparing 2013 to 2020 is interesting because it feels like yesterday, yet the figures are very different. Skids is all ball joints: hips, elbows, ankles, so he's quite floppy to pose, compared to the tighter universal joints we have now. I like the fact the shoulder weapons pop out on a spring, mostly because it means they can be hidden, along with the rockets in the shoulders. The teeth on the wrist guns are nice too, even though it's not really possible to open those out just by pulling one of them. That kind of play pattern is missing these days, but I think we get more robust figures as a result. I read about the hip QC issue, mine is okay for that, but still feels very back heavy and isn't easy to get into a decent pose. The arms don't have much freedom of movement either. Transformation wasn't fun because the lower half of mine detaches from the torso if you try to rotate it, slides straight off the mushroom peg.

If this had a G1 head and was slightly darker blue it would probably be fine for the current style, but he does stand out a bit among the WfC toys.

[The Doctor]

T30 Rhinox has been dug out of a box. He always had a loose right leg but over time both his legs have got so loose he can't stand or balance without falling over.

-Ralph

[Fortmax2020]

Send him to the Brum Robot Docs (Nick and Matt).

[blueshift]

Oct 25, 2020 9:55:21 GMT Fortmax2020 said:

Send him to the Brum Robot Docs (Nick and Matt).

Oh yeah that's an easy fix

[Pinwig]

Jul 23, 2013 11:27:52 GMT Philip Ayres said:

Wave 1 seen in UK TRUs apparently..... but with no comics!

July 2013 the T30 figures first appeared in TRU here. That's just shy of ten years ago.

Ten years since Thrilling 30?

I only mention this because I was just getting TR Quake and Siege Spinister out to go with Needlenose, and thought about Scoop. Who is of course unopened in the T30 box. He might now get opened as I seem to be having a Targetmaster day. Will opening his seal reveal to me what air smelled like ten years ago?

[The Doctor]

Gotta ack -

-Ralph

[Shockprowl]

May 8, 2023 16:05:30 GMT Pinwig said:

Jul 23, 2013 11:27:52 GMT Philip Ayres said:

Wave 1 seen in UK TRUs apparently..... but with no comics!

July 2013 the T30 figures first appeared in TRU here. That's just shy of ten years ago.

Ten years since Thrilling 30?

I only mention this because I was just getting TR Quake and Siege Spinister out to go with Needlenose, and thought about Scoop. Who is of course unopened in the T30 box. He might now get opened as I seem to be having a Targetmaster day. Will opening his seal reveal to me what air smelled like ten years ago?

TELL US ABOUT THE AIR, PINWIG!!!

[Pinwig]

I think this is quite important you know. Eventually, when there is no air in the world, unopened toys may be our only hope. Who'll be laughing then, eh?

[The Doctor]

Until we get to the open-box era.

-Ralph

[Pinwig]

And that... is how we die.

[The Doctor]

But the Earth will live on.

-Ralph