The Hulk

[Grand Moff Muffin]

My admiration for the 2008 film 'The Incredible Hulk' grows with each viewing. Mark Ruffalo does the job well enough in the two Avengers movies, but I keep wishing I could have seen what Edward Norton would have done in those films. I think the scripts would have had to change. I can't see Ruffalo making the 2008 script work, and I can't see Norton delivering the lines Ruffalo had in Avengers. The scripts just aren't written as the same character.

I've got to go with Norton as number one. He conveys that he is constantly stressed and wound up and afraid of himself. Ruffalo by contrast comes across as too chilled out and laid back.

Part of me wonders why the Hulk has had so little love from Marvel Studios - just one solo film, fewer than Thor or Cap, and the only movie with no comic adaptation or tie-in. But part of me thinks it's because the 2008 film told everything important to tell about the Hulk. Without being rushed it had everything - Banner in hiding, Banner chased by soldiers, Hulk defending himself, Banner and Betty, Ross's obsession, and Hulk finally facing off against a true bad guy in defence of the humans who hate him. What's left to show?

Post your Hulk movie thoughts here!

Martin

[Baron B of Triple B]

Norton without a doubt and The Incredible Hulk is a very good movie. It's a far better portrayal of Hulk than the Avengers movies as well. AOU Hulk was especially crap, an unconvincing Banner and a weedy Hulk. They just never be able to settle on which way they want to go. Is he out of control, is he not? Does he control Banner or is it the other way round?

At least in TIH there was a clear vision of what they wanted. I agree with you, i dont thin Norton would work as the Avengers incarnation of Banner. They also seem fairly content with Hulk as a secondary character so make peace with no more standalone Hulk films for now.

[Philip Ayres]

If they do another Hulk film it needs to be an adaptation of Hulk 290, the greatest Hulk story of all time!

[Toph]

Hulk (or at least Banner) was originally drafted into Civil War. But Ruffalo said Marvel pulled him out because it would interfere with other plans, that they didn't tell him.

My belief is Planet Hulk.

But I have to say I've never seen the Ang Lee Hulk, and I didn't see TIH until last year on a commercial channel.
Ruffalo is my first exposure to any sort of movie Hulk.
And Hulk doesn't seem to sell as a movie. The Lee movie bombed, and the Marvel movie didn't do well by their standards. Otherwise they'd probably make several more.

Also, Hulk is really hard to write for. Without acknowledging that Hulk is played as an intellegent character for the last several decades, it's hard to create stories that aren't just "Big green monster that everyone's afraid of until he has to go beat up other big monster."

[Grand Moff Muffin]

I was amused by the Stan Lee Hulk pocketbook I just read, in which the Hulk speaks to himself (and the reader) in virtually every panel. Just wouldn't work on camera - I think he has spoken three words so far in the Marvel cinematic universe ("Hulk smash" and "Betty"). Also, in the pocketbook, Banner hardly appeared. I think he was in Hulk mode for 90% of the time.

it's hard to create stories that aren't just "Big green monster that everyone's afraid of until he has to go beat up other big monster."

That's true if you have the Hulk on screen for more than a few minutes at a time. However, as the Edward Norton film proved, you can tell lots of great stories about Banner on the run from the army and trying to cure himself of the thing he might (but doesn't have to in every story) become.

In Marvel, is Banner normally in Hulk mode, or like the movies is he only transformed for the occasional tantrum? (I know he's gone through different phases when it's not just emotion that triggers him, stupid phases, clever phases, good phases, evil phases.)

Martin

[Kingoji]

Jan 19, 2016 7:10:40 GMT Grand Moff Muffin said:

I was amused by the Stan Lee Hulk pocketbook I just read, in which the Hulk speaks to himself (and the reader) in virtually every panel. Just wouldn't work on camera - I think he has spoken three words so far in the Marvel cinematic universe ("Hulk smash" and "Betty").

How can you forget "Puny God"?

[The Doctor]

I will care about the cinematic Hulk when he learns to speak and not before.

-Ralph

[blueshift]

I'm pretty sure we've not seen a Hulk film as Universal would have distribution rights, or something like that

[Jim]

I will go with Ruffalo, who was particularly good in the first Avengers movie; I haven't seen the Norton movie though I could believe I would be impressed as he is a very good actor.

The Ang Lee film has a lot of interesting stuff going on, but the final battle is a total mess (to be fair, the final battle in Iron Man isn't the best either) and it never quite comes together into something really satisfying.

-Jim

[Grand Moff Muffin]

Jan 19, 2016 21:05:20 GMT Jim said:

I will go with Ruffalo, who was particularly good in the first Avengers movie; I haven't seen the Norton movie though I could believe I would be impressed as he is a very good actor.

See it! And then change your vote.

General Ross is going to be in Captain America: Civil War, so everyone should see TIH again before that comes out anyway.



The final fight is a good one.

Martin

[Shockprowl]

Oooohhhhhh.....

Good thread, and a good question.


Errrrrr......


Hmmmmmm......



Yeah, I'm gonna have to get back to you....

[Jim]

Jan 20, 2016 6:36:52 GMT Grand Moff Muffin said:

Jan 19, 2016 21:05:20 GMT Jim said:

I will go with Ruffalo, who was particularly good in the first Avengers movie; I haven't seen the Norton movie though I could believe I would be impressed as he is a very good actor.

See it! And then change your vote.

I will! I keep forgetting it exists, and should have some time to catch up on films at half term.

-Jim

[blueshift]

Jan 18, 2016 20:22:06 GMT Grand Moff Muffin said:

What's left to show?

I submit for evidence the popular Incredible Hulk tv show that ran in the 70s/80s!!

[Shockprowl]

I've gone for Ruffalo just over Norton. I agree it would have been fascinating to see Norton in the Avengers Movies and it would have been a totally different Banner. But, I do just really like Ruffalo and his performances.

[primenova]

Should Marvel gets the rights back for Hulk? Or do they get funding for the films when his rights are sold to someone else?

[Toph]

Jan 27, 2016 13:07:59 GMT primenova said:

Should Marvel gets the rights back for Hulk? Or do they get funding for the films when his rights are sold to someone else?

It's a license. Disney makes money no matter who makes the movie.
But unless it's marvel studios or disney studios, they have to share the profit, and that's so unacceptible to them that they would rather destroy the Fantastic Four and X-Men.
(Spiderman gets a save by being the single most iconic thing Marvel has. It would be suicide to destroy him)

But I don't think this is the issue with Hulk.

[Stomski]

Rewatching the 2002 Hulk. Half an hour in, only good bit so far was Stan Lee talking with Lou Ferrigno. It's just... empty.

Ang Lee's choice of comic book panel shot in shot multi camera angles is horrid.

[Toph]

You know, since Disney isn't interested in the Hulk franchise, I with they would release the characters to be used elsewhere in the MCU.
I don't see any reasons why The Leader couldn't be a major villain in SHIELD, or why General Ross couldn't turn up in SHIELD, or a Cap movie.

[Grand Moff Muffin]

Can someone tell me if 'Mr Blue' from the Edward Norton film was supposed to be someone of significance in the comics? The way his brain was enlarged in his final scenes, I thought he might be becoming the Leader, but I've only ever read one Leader story so that may be an error on my part.

Judging by the trailer, General Ross is in the new Cap movie.

Martin

[Toph]

You're right, he is.
He's also played by William Hurt, which I did not know. That would be why HE'S off limits to SHIELD. (Big actors are unlikely to reprise their film roles in television spinoffs. Even the ones who're willing are likely too expensive to be feasible)
I thought he was played by Ted Levine, for some reason.

[Grand Moff Muffin]

Mar 9, 2016 17:59:53 GMT Grand Moff Muffin said:

Can someone tell me if 'Mr Blue' from the Edward Norton film was supposed to be someone of significance in the comics? The way his brain was enlarged in his final scenes, I thought he might be becoming the Leader, but I've only ever read one Leader story so that may be an error on my part.

I've looked it up. Mr Blue in the Incredible Hulk movie was referred to as Samuel Sterns, which is the name of the Leader in the comics. So the Leader is in the MCU.

Martin

[Kingoji]

I do love the Hulk as a character, but I agree they struggle to translate him into live action (quote/unquote). I think the current MCU version is the best we've had it so far. I also like the implication that the MCU Hulk IS intelligent, and fully capable of speech... he just has no use for it generally.
As for which Banner... I actually think that Norton is the worst of the most recent three. Bana was really good at looking like he could blow at any second, without notice, and with hardly any desire NOT to. Norton needed to keep showing us his watch, because he's an utterly bland emotional performer (Yes, I have seen Fight Club).
Ruffalo is the best, as he is sold as being someone who has lived with this a long time, has explored the condition made attempts to deal with it, tried to end it, yet is forced to live with it... and has gotten kind of used to it and found his method of coping. And that dry wit makes him probably my second favourite actor in the MCU so far, after Hiddleston.

And oh my God, yes, I am so over Hydra. The biggest let down in the MCU is that with their TV series and SHIELD in particular they have all these open avenues to bring in threats that the movies are unlikely to deal with... and they don't use them. The Leader would be perfect for a series-long arc in SHIELD, but of course he's The Leader so he'd have to either ultimately win on some level or flat out escape.

[legios]

I really must get around to seeing the Ang Lee Hulk film at some point I guess. I didn't see it in theatres, and when it was last on TV it was up against the fact that I had something else on rental I wanted to see. I've seen the other Hulk film which, in honesty struck me as "ok". It was nothing special but functional in terms of what it was going for.

So a bit "Age of Ultron" really.

Karl