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Post by Fortmax2020 on Jan 2, 2019 22:04:31 GMT
Oh, and the other thing that bugged me was the way it kept implying that Cyclonus dying before he was created was a paradox that worsened the rift. It wasn't a paradox. Cyclonus killing his past self before he was created would have been a paradox, but there's nothing paradoxical about a time-traveller himself getting killed. Martin As far we know. Perhaps Cyclonus was rebuilt into the Decepticon that became Cyclonus?
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 2, 2019 22:12:57 GMT
That makes about as much logical sense as anything else in Time Wars.
Martin
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Jan 3, 2019 7:36:20 GMT
Perfect!
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Jan 3, 2019 7:37:31 GMT
Two Megatrons... TWO CYCLONUSESESES!
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Post by Pinwig on Jan 3, 2019 12:18:22 GMT
Oh, and the other thing that bugged me was the way it kept implying that Cyclonus dying before he was created was a paradox that worsened the rift. It wasn't a paradox. Cyclonus killing his past self before he was created would have been a paradox, but there's nothing paradoxical about a time-traveller himself getting killed. Martin As far we know. Perhaps Cyclonus was rebuilt into the Decepticon that became Cyclonus? This was the Admiral's 11k post.
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The Huff
Thunderjet
Hufferlover
Posts: 4,107
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Post by The Huff on Jan 3, 2019 16:09:14 GMT
I always wondered why it was such a big deal Optimus being face to face with Rodimus when Hot Rod, Kup & Co were also on earth in 1989.
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Post by The Doctor on Jan 3, 2019 18:22:26 GMT
Because it was the present and future leaders meeting face to face!!!
TIME WARS was the event of 1989. It was so exciting. I will not hear a bad word against it!!!
-Ralph
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Jan 3, 2019 21:48:34 GMT
As far we know. Perhaps Cyclonus was rebuilt into the Decepticon that became Cyclonus? This was the Admiral's 11k post. Magnificent I must.
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primenova
Fusilateral Quintro Combiner
Posts: 6,008
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Post by primenova on Jan 3, 2019 22:01:04 GMT
Oh, and the other thing that bugged me was the way it kept implying that Cyclonus dying before he was created was a paradox that worsened the rift. It wasn't a paradox. Cyclonus killing his past self before he was created would have been a paradox, but there's nothing paradoxical about a time-traveller himself getting killed. Martin Cyclonus & Scourge where in the past without being displaced so the past was 2 top heavy. Then one person got killed which set the rift off.
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Post by The Doctor on Jan 4, 2019 10:01:06 GMT
Better than a curry setting the rift off.
-Ralph
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The Huff
Thunderjet
Hufferlover
Posts: 4,107
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Post by The Huff on Jan 4, 2019 13:58:49 GMT
With the displacement thing - do the people have to be of a similar size? If so, then how would Prime, Ratchet & Prowl fill Galvatron, Cyclonus & Scourge's shoes?
Did Primes trailer get displaced at the same time I wonder?
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primenova
Fusilateral Quintro Combiner
Posts: 6,008
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Post by primenova on Jan 4, 2019 21:32:25 GMT
But the con displacements where off more than the bots - Frenzy = Kup?
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Post by Pinwig on Jan 4, 2019 21:42:45 GMT
Better than a curry setting the rift off. -Ralph We've all been there.
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The Huff
Thunderjet
Hufferlover
Posts: 4,107
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Post by The Huff on Jan 4, 2019 23:01:07 GMT
But the con displacements where off more than the bots - Frenzy = Kup? I always put that down to also having Shockwave there (who is bigger) so it was probably Thundercracker = Blurr and then some of Shockwave = Hot Rod and then the rest of Shockwave and little Frenzy making up for Kup.
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 5, 2019 6:41:29 GMT
With the displacement thing - do the people have to be of a similar size? If so, then how would Prime, Ratchet & Prowl fill Galvatron, Cyclonus & Scourge's shoes? Did Primes trailer get displaced at the same time I wonder? The 'mass displacement' explanation didn't make much sense. For one thing, why do they have to displace other Transformers? Why not just displace water from the ocean, or a bit of rock? For another thing, if mass balance matters, why doesn't the thing being displaced go to the future to replace the thing being sent to the past? If it goes to Limbo, then Limbo surely becomes too heavy and the future too light. For a third thing, it's a big universe with matter constantly being created and destroyed - why does a bit more or less matter? For a fourth thing, why didn't the monsters that Skids brought back from Limbo in 'Survivors' make 1989 too heavy and cause a new rift? Ditto Galvatron #2, brought to the present by Hook, Line and Sinker. Maybe the mass displacement theory was a mistake, and what matters is really numbers of sentient minds, not mass? That would explain why Cyclonus dying mattered, even though he still weighed the same after being killed. The rule can't apply to humans, because the likes of the Doctor (who met Death's Head after 'The Legacy of Unicron') and Reed Richards (mentioned in TF US #3) have time machines that don't cause rifts in time and space. But it's not just TFs - Death's Head displaced First Aid to Limbo the first time he went back in time. But then after the Doctor shrunk Death's Head, DH seemed to be OK with time-travel without displacing people to Limbo. The Flashback Doorway Megatron invented during Earthforce seemed the safest way for TFs to travel in time, since it sent their minds back into bodies that were already in the past. But what became of Snaptrap's mind when Megatron took over? Did it just go to sleep, or did it end up in future Megatron's body, or did it go to Limbo? Martin
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Jan 5, 2019 10:04:29 GMT
They can't be transported to the future yet as it doesn't exist from their present day perspective.
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Post by The Doctor on Jan 5, 2019 10:55:40 GMT
Mass displacement makes perfect sense in the context of a comic for children. Don't overthink it!
-Ralph
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The Huff
Thunderjet
Hufferlover
Posts: 4,107
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Post by The Huff on Jan 5, 2019 12:43:41 GMT
But...TFUK was the one thing that didn't treat us like children.
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Jan 5, 2019 13:36:23 GMT
Exactly. Get your thinking caps on. folks!
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 5, 2019 15:59:38 GMT
Mass displacement makes perfect sense in the context of a comic for children. Child Martin didn't think so. Martin
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Jan 5, 2019 16:44:02 GMT
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Post by The Doctor on Jan 5, 2019 16:57:06 GMT
Mass displacement makes perfect sense in the context of a comic for children. Don't overthink it! -Ralph But...TFUK was the one thing that didn't treat us like children. Hmmm. I don't think I put my point across properly. Apologies. What I meant was that the idea of mass displacement is the kind of mad idea that makes sense in the context of a comic aimed at children. It's the kind of thing that appeals to kids. Adults demand more detail on how it works. As a kid the 'one in, one out' principle behind it is enough info. -Ralph
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primenova
Fusilateral Quintro Combiner
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Post by primenova on Jan 5, 2019 22:01:46 GMT
Time travel displacement didn't happen in the Marvel 616 universe. With Limbo being different (Magik & Nightcrawler used the realm) - also is Limbo going to mess with Unicron when he wanted to pluck a Galvatron from a different time line - which could explain while Limbo wasn't used - need to be same timeline?
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Post by Philip Ayres on Jan 5, 2019 22:56:06 GMT
There's no real connection between Nightcrawler and either of the MU Limbos beyond his appearance in Magik's Limbo in the Magik Limited Series. It's certainly not central to his powers. Magik's Limbo is a different Limbo to the proper one seen as far back as early issues of the Avengers! en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limbo_(Marvel_Comics)
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primenova
Fusilateral Quintro Combiner
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Post by primenova on Jan 6, 2019 14:26:48 GMT
I'm sure it said once he teleported across Limbo once in a story. But then it wasn't noted by other writers so can't remember which issue it was.
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Post by Pinwig on Jan 8, 2019 19:18:08 GMT
30 Years Ago This Week: Issue #200 Time Wars - Part 2: Earth 1989: Ravage, tricked into falling down a mineshaft in issue #73 by Skids, is awakened by an earthquake. He tries to find his way back to the surface, but instead comes across Cyclonus, Fracas and Galvatron. Meanwhile, Optimus Prime briefs his troops on a theory developed by Highbrow that the current space/time disruption is being caused by Galvatron's presence, and he therefore must be attacked. Highbrow himself is elsewhere wondering what to do with Scorponok's head (gained in the 1989 Annual) when he is attacked by the Deception Headmasters. Optimus and crew come to Highbrow's aid, only to witness the arrival of Rodimus and friends from 2009. The displacement causes Optimus and several other Autobots to vanish into limbo, which causes Fortress Maximus to launch an attack on Rodimus. Elsewhere, it's the big 200th issue, featuring a brand new logo and a wraparound cover by Lee Sullivan. There's a twelve page free gift entitled Transformers - The Facts which reveals that Xaaron's alt-mode is a small combat tank, Rack'N Ruin used to transform into jets but now can't since the 'operation' and Grimlock only chooses to be dumb some of the time because he sees being intellectual as a weakness. There's the first part of the 1989 calendar, featuring recoloured Geoff Senior art from the cover of issue #117; Colin and Steve foil King Nonose's latest plan without realising in a special Robo Capers crossover; a two page pictorial history of the Transformers gets new readers caught up; and there's a competition to win one of 200 new Microbots sets, advertising the fact the Race Car, Off Road and Air Strike Patrol teams are in shops now!
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tomwe
Protoform
Tom reads comics
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Post by tomwe on Jan 8, 2019 21:18:42 GMT
Such a sweet cover! I have barely any recollection of Time Wars the story other than the way Big G is ripped up. Looking forward to it turning up in The G1 Collection.
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Post by Philip Ayres on Jan 8, 2019 21:42:45 GMT
The displacement causes Optimus and several other Autobots to vanish into limbo, which causes Fortress Maximus to launch an attack on Rodimus. Not Max's finest hour. Was this the first time Furman wrote him? I get the feeling Max wasn't his favourite character! and there's a competition to win one of 200 new Microbots sets, advertising the fact the Race Car, Off Road and Air Strike Patrol teams are in shops now! Any chance of a scan of that?
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Post by Pinwig on Jan 8, 2019 22:42:21 GMT
No problem
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Jan 9, 2019 3:31:42 GMT
Not Max's finest hour. Was this the first time Furman wrote him? I get the feeling Max wasn't his favourite character! It reflects worse on Ironhide and Wheeljack, who were there when Prime and co. vanished in T:2006 and should have realised what was going on. Martin
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