Jim
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Post by Jim on Mar 25, 2019 22:00:13 GMT
I just finished the Cap epic which contains the start of the Englehart run. It's amazing how it upticks in quality the moment he comes on board. Not exactly bad before that, some issues are quite good, but nothing that really sticks in the mind. Brilliant issue co-written with Gerber in there as well. Looking forward to vol 5. Not yet scheduled :-( Yeah, I know! Can't believe they're finally getting to such an interesting run after two relatively mediocre volumes and then waiting! I just saw that there's a Howling Commandos epic due out (or maybe already out). I really enjoyed the WW2 issues of Lee and Kirby's Cap so might give that a look. |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Mar 25, 2019 22:48:54 GMT
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Jim
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Post by Jim on Mar 25, 2019 22:54:18 GMT
Excellent work! I'm glad you're keeping track of these things. Ever since they "upgraded" the forum on the MMW message board I've been more out of touch than I was.
I'd already forgotten about Moon Knight v3 and Wolverine v2!
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Post by Philip Ayres on Mar 25, 2019 23:01:51 GMT
Bookmark the link, it's possibly complete for 2019. I'll start a new 2020 one.
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Post by Philip Ayres on Mar 25, 2019 23:42:01 GMT
The HC contents are probably worth a look at for working out future Epics | Volume | X-Force | Annuals | Extras | | Assault on Graymalkin | 19–25 | | New Warriors 31 | | Toy Soldiers | 26–31 | 2 | Nomad 20 | | Child's Play | 32–37 | 3 | New Warriors 44–46 | | Phalanx Covenant | 38–43 | | X-Factor 106, Excalibur 82 |
Their Fatal Attractions issues 25 is double sized but stand alone Their Phalanx issue is #38: 36 pages and crosses into the X-Factor & Excalibur issues listed. OK.... Pretty confident X-Force v3 is 20-33 (14 issues, equivalent to 15 as 25 is double sized) + the double sized annual 2 (2 issues, brings us to 17) and New Warriors 44-46 (3 issues, brings us to 20), incorporating the Child's Play crossover in those 3 New Warriors and the last 2 X-Force. V4 needs some research .... 43 is the last issue pre Age of Apocalypse, 11 issues further on. Their Phalanx issue is double sized, call it 12. The X-Factor and Excalibur Phalanx issues are double sized too, bringing it up to 16. Annual 3, double sized, 18. All but there....,. Throw in Cable 20 his pre AOA issue and that'd be it I think. |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Mar 26, 2019 8:22:16 GMT
ShockprowlThey collect each series with the issues in the correct order in nice chunky volumes. They have a lovely trade dress. Each volume has a good amount of story and makes sense as a collection. They're also not being released in chronological order, ostensibly concentrating on stuff which hasn't been released before, so there's some fun to be had trying to work out what's in what volume and what might be coming next. Iron Man for example, the launch title with a much desired story, has released volumes 10, 16, 1, 13, 11, 2, 15, 14 & 3 in that order! So he's now got volumes 10-16 out ..... or would have if volume 12 wasn't still missing, which finishes a story started in volume 10! This last week Marvel's distributor Hachette pumped out a lot of information on new Epics which proved very interesting. Two titles that hadn't had release for a few years came back, there was some interesting handling of a crossover and a new release for Avengers which has had a particularly difficult to guess last few volumes..... that led us into talk of Onslaught, the event that closes the original Avengers title (and Thor, Iron Man, Captain America and FF) 1996's Onslaught appears to be the rough line in the sand for when the Epics finish: we have immediate pre Onslaught volumes for FF, Thor & Cap and no later. However there are later books out there for the likes of Wolverine & Hulk who didn't get cancelled & rebooted at Onslaught: Wolverine has material printed into 2002, close to the end of main volume of his comic title and after Sentry 1 is printed. The latest title to start an Epic collection is X-Force whose first issue came out in June 1991. Sweet Jebus that's a lot of comics! So they are a fancy collected edition. Soft or hard cover? What titles? Big Phil likes his X-Men doesn't he? Phil has bought ALL the Marvel Universe Epics. My current count stands at 113, with 2 more in the post, 1 waiting on the right price and 23 scheduled between now and the end of the year. There are some X-Men volumes in there. The link I used above will be educational Wikipedia Epic Collection Link
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Post by blueshift on Mar 26, 2019 8:49:31 GMT
113?!? PHIL!!!!!
that's a lot
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Post by Philip Ayres on Mar 26, 2019 8:57:22 GMT
Do the sums over all the potential volumes and it gets VERY scary numbers
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Post by Philip Ayres on Mar 26, 2019 10:24:55 GMT
113?!? PHIL!!!!! that's a lot Do the sums over all the potential volumes and it gets VERY scary numbers Matt got me thinking. So I did some guessing, some maths and arrived at a VERY scary number: 341 volumes! And that's assuming X-Men 19 is the last!!!!! | TITLE | ISSUES | EPICS | REASON | REASONING | | IRON MAN | 332 | 20 | Guess | On 16, 55 issues to go,3 volumes, throw in another for OGS, Crossing etc | | THOR | 502 | 23 | Known | 23 is out, Onslaught | | AMAZING SPIDER-MAN | 441 | 29 | Guess | 22 is out, 360. 80 issues to go but Clone Saga | | AVENGERS | 402 | 28 | Guess | 24 is coming, looks 4 vs of material left | | FANTASTIC FOUR | 416 | 25 | Known | 25 is out, Onslaught | | CAPTAIN AMERICA | 454 | 22 | Known | 22 is out, Onslaught | | Daredevil | 380 | 21 | Known | 21 is out with 380 in | | Defenders | 152 | 9 | Known | 8 is out, 1 volume material left | | Doctor Strange | 183, 81, 90 | 13 | Known | 13 is out with DSSS 90 in it | | Hulk | 474 | 24 | Guess | 22 is out with 448, 2 v of material to go | | Silver Surfer | 146 | 14 | Guess | 13 is out with 138 in it | | Wolverine | 189 | 15 | Guess | 13 is out with 158 in it, 2 v of material to go but specials/crossovers? | | Uncanny X-Men | 544 | 19 | ??? | 19 is the current upper limit and X-Men 1 is a good cuttoff before crossover craziness | | New Mutants | 100 | 8 | Guess | 6 is out with 85 in it. Inc crossover 2 volumes of material | | X-Force | 129 | 9 | Guess | 2 is coming with 19 in it. Guessed contents through to v4 & issue 43. At least 5 Vs after that | | Excalibur | 125 | 8 | Guess | 3 is out with 41 in it. Gets easier from here. 5 vs to soak up material | | X-Factor | 149 | 11 | Guess | 8 Scheduled with 100 in it. 3 Vs to finish | | Marvel Two-In-One | 100 | 5 | Guess | v1 out with 19. Most remianing issues are 17 pages so easily fit annuals in too | | West Coast Avengers | 102 | 6 | Guess | v2 schedule to 24. 4 vs to use remaining issues, add another for annuals and crossovers | | Punisher | 104 | 9 | Guess | v7 out to 75. 2 would more than soak up issues but there's LOTS of Punisher specials and guests | | Iron Fist | 15 | 1 | Known | Done | | PMIF | 50-125 | 4 | Known | v3 scheduled with 107, 1v to go | | Master of Kung-Fu | 125 | 6 | Guess | v2 scheduled with 53. under 4 vs of material, lots of 17 pages, could be 3 | | Ms Marvel | 23 | 2 | Known | Done | | Sgt Fury | 167 (120) | 6 | Guess | 120 is last original issue, but there's some reprints before that to make room for the annuals | | Ant Man | ? | 2 | Guess | Some Ant/Giant Man not yet reprinted | | Black Panther | 24,15 | 2 | Known | Done |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Mar 31, 2019 6:53:27 GMT
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Post by Philip Ayres on Apr 1, 2019 10:02:55 GMT
Since we probably have all the 2019 Epics now, some stats for you: 39 Epics in 2019 vs 34 in 2018 5 2018 titles haven't appeared in 2019 Moon Knight
Marvel Two-In-One
Star Wars: Legends Legacy
Star Wars: Legends The Clone Wars
Star Wars: Legends The New Republic 3 more long running titles haven't had a second, older, volume Avengers
Captain America
Thor Avengers did have two Modern volumes this year though! 8 titles had a 2019 volume that didn't in 2018. 3 were new, 5 returned from previous years Ms. Marvel
Sgt Fury
Conan Chronicles
Power Man & Iron Fist
Black Panther
Star Wars: Legends The Old Republic
Star Wars: Legends The Rebellion
Star Wars: Legends The Newspaper Strips In addition two recurring titles had a second volume Iron Man - Older
X-Men - Newer While two new titles had multiple volumes Ms. Marvel x 2 - presumably to neatly tie in with film and home video release
Conan Chronicles x 3 Ms Marvel is presumed completed this year, while Defenders has had the final volume released, with earlier volumes still to come. The largest run of consecutive volumes is now Amazing Spider-Man with 6 (17-22)
Thor with 5 (1-5)
X-Men with 5 (1-5)
Iron Man with 4
ASM with 4 (in addition the above 6 book run)
Avengers with 4 (twice)
FF with 4
Captain America with 4
Daredevil with 4 (twice)
Hulk with 4 (twice)
Defeneders with 4 The following titles all have one volume gaps that will form larger runs: ASM (v16, 8 volumes)
Iron Man (v12, 7 volumes)
Captain America (v14, 6 volumes)
FF (v19, 5 volumes)
Power Man & Iron Fist (v4, 4 volumes completing the set)
Avengers (v8, 3 volumes)
Doctor Strange (v2, 3 volumes)
Silver Surfer (v2, 3 volumes)
X-Men (v18, 3 volumes)
Punisher (v1, 3 volumes)
The largest gaps are Hulk (14 volumes, 5-18)
FF (12 volumes, 5-16)
Daredevil (8 volumes, 5-12)
ASM (7 volumes, 8-14, plus however many post v22)
Excalibur (at least 6 volumes, 4 onwards)
X-Force (at least 6 volumes, 3 onwards)
Iron Man (6 volumes, 4-9)
Avengers (6 volumes, 10-15, plus probably 4 volumes post v24)
Uncanny X-Men (6 volumes, 6-11 and 4 volumes, 13-16 plus however many post v19)
Silver Surfer (5 volumes, 8-12)
Wolverine (5 volumes, 3-7)
Thor (5 volumes, 6-10 and 4 volumes, 19-22)
Defenders (5 volumes, 1-5)
Captain America (4 volumes twice 4-8 & 18-20)
Doctor Strange (4 volumes twice, 4-7 & 9-12)
X-Factor (4 volumes, 2-6)
Marvel Two In One (at least 4 volumes, 2 onwards)
West Coast Avengers (at least 4 volumes, 2 onwards) |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Apr 1, 2019 10:27:23 GMT
We might be able to have a punt at some of the titles for the one volume gaps: ASM (v16, 8 volumes)
Iron Man (v12, 7 volumes) - Iron Monger or Resolutions (200)
Captain America (v14, 6 volumes) - The Captain
FF (v19, 5 volumes) - The Dream Is Dead (332)
Power Man & Iron Fist (v4, 4 volumes completing the set) - Dragon Slayer (120)
Avengers (v8, 3 volumes) - The Serpent Crown
Doctor Strange (v2, 3 volumes) - ???
Silver Surfer (v2, 3 volumes) - ???
X-Men (v18, 3 volumes) - X-tinction Agenda
Punisher (v1, 3 volumes) - The Punisher Strikes Twice (ASM 129)
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Post by Philip Ayres on Apr 16, 2019 13:25:59 GMT
Having needed to look at some of my Epic Predictions in the last few weeks, I've discovered a couple of titles are scattered in bits. So... X-Men| Volume | Issues | Annual | Extras | | 1 Children of the Atom | 1-23 | | | | 2 Lonely Are The Hunted | 24-45 | | Avengers 53
material from Not Brand Echh 4, 8 | | 3 The Sentinels Live | 46-66 | | material from Ka-Zar #2–3 and Marvel Tales # 30 | | 4 It's Always Darkest Before The Dawn | | | Amazing Adventures 11-17
Amazing Spider-Man 92
Incredible Hulk 150, 161, 172, 180-182
Marvel Team-Up 4, 23
Avengers 110-111
Captain America 172-175
Defenders 15-16
Giant-Size Fantastic Four 4
covers for X-Men 67-93, Annual 1-2 | | 5 Second Genesis | 94-110 | | Giant Size X-Men 1
Iron Fist 14–15
Marvel Team-Up 53, 69–70, Annual 1
material from FOOM #10 | | 6 | 111-128 | 3 | | | 7 | 129-144 | 4 | Marvel Team Up 89 Nightcrawler
Possibly Marvel Two In One 68 Angel | | 8 | 145-157 | 5 | Bizarre Adventures 27
Avengers Annual 10
Possibly Marvel Two In One 76 Iceman
Rom 17 & 18 would go in here if they could be printed | | 9 | 158-168 | 6 | Marvel Team Up 117 Wolverine and 118 Professor X
Magik 1-4 (published later, but fits in UXM 160) | | 10 | 169-176 | 7 | God Loves, Man Kills
Wolverine 1-4
Marvel Team Up 135 Kitty Pryde
possibly Daredevil 176 | | 11 | 177-188 | | Kitty Pryde & Wolverine 1-6
Marvel Team Up 150 X-Men | | 12 The Gift | 189-198 | 8 | X-Men and Alpha Flight 1–2
Nightcrawler 1–4 | | 13 | 199-209 | 9-10 | New Mutants Special Edition
New Mutants Annual 2 | | 14 | 210-219 | 11 | Spider-Man vs Wolverine
FF vs X-Men 1-4
X-Men vs Avengers 1-4 | | 15 | 220-238 | | Hulk 340 | | 16 | 239-247 | 12-13 | X-Factor 36-39 | | 17 Dissolution and Rebirth | 248-267 | | | | 18 | 268-277 | 14 | New Mutants 95-97 & Annual 6
X-Factor 60-62 & Annual 5
Fantastic Four Annual 23 | | 19 Mutants Genesis | 278-280 | 15 | X-Factor 65-70
X-Men 1-3
New Mutants Annual 7
X-Factor Annual 6 |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Apr 16, 2019 13:38:06 GMT
AVENGERS| EPIC | ISSUES | ANNUAL | EXTRAS & NOTES | | 1 Earth's Mightiest Heroes | 1-20 | | | | 2 Once an Avenger | 21-40 | | | | 3 Masters of Evil | 41-56 | 1-2 | X-Men 45
material from: Not Brand Echh 5, 8 | | 4 Behold... The Vision | 57-76 | | Marvel Super Heroes 17 | | 5 | 77-97 | | Hulk 140 | | 6 | 98-114 | | Daredevil 99
?? | | 7 The Avengers/Defenders War | 115–128 | | Giant-Size 1
Defenders 8–11;
Captain Marvel 33;
Fantastic Four 150 | | 8 | 129-149 | | Avengers Giant Size 2-4 | | 9 The Final Threat | 150-166 | 6-7 | Super-Villain Team-Up 9
Marvel Two-in-One Annual 2 | | 10 | 167-187 | 8 | Thor Annual 7? | | 11 | 188-204 | 9 | | | 12 | 205-220 | 10 | MTIO 75 (Avengers) | | 13 | 221-232 | 11 | Amazing Spider-Man Annual 16
Vision & Scarlet Witch 1-4 | | 14 | 233-249 | 12 | FF 256 | | 15 | 250-263 | 13-14 | FF Annual 19 | | 16 Under Siege | 264–277 | 15 | West Coast Avengers Annual #1
Alpha Flight #39 | | 17 Judgment Day | 278–285 | 16 | Marvel Graphic Novel #27: Emperor Doom
X-Men vs. Avengers #1–4
West Coast Avengers Annual #2 | | 18 | 286-303 | 17 Evolutionary War | | | 19 | 304-318 | 18 Atlantis Attacks | Avengers West Coast 54 & 55 (Acts of Vengeance) | | 20 | 319-333 | 19 Terminus Factor | Captain America Annual #9
Iron Man Annual #11
Thor Annual #15
Avengers West Coast Annual #5 | | 21 The Collection Obsession | 334–344 | 20 Subterranean Wars | Avengers: Deathtrap – The Vault
And material from:
Incredible Hulk Annual #17
Namor, the Sub-Mariner Annual #1
Iron Man Annual #12
Avengers West Coast Annual #6 | | 22 Operation: Galactic Storm | 345–347 | | Avengers West Coast #80–82
Quasar #32–34
Wonder Man #7–9
Iron Man #278–279
Thor #445–446
Captain America #401
And material from:
Captain America #398–400 | | 23 Fear the Reaper | 348-359 | 21 Citizen Kang | Material from:
Captain America Annual #11
Thor Annual #17
Fantastic Four Annual #25 | | 24 The Gatherers Strike! | 360-366 | 22 | Strikefile
Anniversary Magazine
The Terminatrix Objective 1-4 | | 25 | 367-378 | 23 | X-Men #26
Avengers West Coast #101-102
Uncanny X-Men #307 | | 26 | 379-391 | | Taking Aim: Cap 440 & 441
Iron Man #319-320
Avengers: The Crossing
Force Works #16 | | 27 | 392-395 | | Iron Man #321-325
Force Works #17-20
War Machine #20-23
Avengers: Timeslide
Age of Innocence - The Rebirth of Iron Man | | 28 | 396-402 | | First Sign:
Captain America 449
Thor #496
Iron Man #326
Onslaught:
Onslaught X-Men
Fantastic Four 414-415
Uncanny 335-336
X-Men 55
Hulk 445
Onslaught Marvel Universe |
| V | Issues | Annual | Extras | | 1 The Man Without Fear | 1-21 | | | | 2 Mike Murdock Must Die! | 22-41 | 1 | | | 3 Brother, Take My Hand | 42-63 | | Fantastic Four #73
And material from:
Not Brand Echh #4 | | 4 A Woman Called Widow | 64-85? | | | | 5 | 86-107 | | | | 6 | 108-129 | | | | 7 | 130-151 | 4 | | | 8 | 152-173 | | | | 9 | 174-193 | | | | 10 | 194-213 | | | | 11 | 214-233 | | | | 12 | 234-252 | | | | 13 A Touch of Typhoid | 253-270 | | Punisher 10 | | 14 Heart of Darkness | 271-282 | 5-6 | material from: Punisher Annual #3; Incredible Hulk Annual #16; Silver Surfer Annual #3 | | 15 | 283-296 | | Elektra Lives Again | | 16 | 297-309 | 7 | Van Strucker Gambit: Punisher Annual #4 & Captain America Annual #10 | | 17 | 310-318 | 8 & 9 | System Bytes: Punisher Annual #5, Wonder Man Annual #1 & Guardians of the Galaxy Annual #2, DD vs Vapora 1 | | 18 Fall From Grace | 319-322 | 10 | | | 19 Root of Evil | 333-344 | | Elektra: Root of Evil #1–4 | | 20 Purgatory & Paradise | 345-364 | | | | 21 Widow's Kiss | 365-380, -1 | 1997 | |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Apr 18, 2019 10:58:25 GMT
Last 4 2019 Epics are up on Amazon UK |
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Post by Philip Ayres on May 6, 2019 19:54:58 GMT
The subject of the Thor Simonson run has come up twice today, first in a Comixology sale and then on TwitterThe Thor Simonson run runs from 337-382 he writes all of those issues bar 356 and 371 which are fill ins. With the exception of issue 356, Simonson is on art till issue 367 then Our Pal Sal takes over till 382, with the exception of issue 380 which Simonson draws. www.mikesamazingworld.com/mikes/features/series.php?seriesid=3980&page=galleryThe run has been reprinted in it's entirety in the Thor Visionaries series Missing in there are the 356 & 371 fill ins and Annuals 12-13. It's also been recoloured in these trades: There's enough material for another volume, but since v4 was mid 2018 and there's not another on the runway for this year, I think they might be done www.hachettebookgroup.biz/search/?q=thor&group_by_isbn=onWhich brings us on to the Epic Collections: | 1 The God of Thunder | 83-109 | | | 2 When Titans Clash | 110-130 | 1 | | 3 The Wrath of Odin | 131-153 | 2 | | 4 To Wake the Mangog | 154-174 | | | 5 The Fall of Asgard | 175-194 | | | 6 | | | | 7 | | | | 8 | | | | 9 | | | | 10 | | | | 11 A Kingdom Lost | 303-319 | 9-10 | | 12 Runequest | 320-336 | 11 | | 13 | | | | 14 | | | | 15 | | | | 16 War of the Pantheons | 383-400 | | | 17 In Mortal Flesh | 401-418 | 14 | | 18 The Black Galaxy | 419-436 | 15 | | 19 | | | | 20 | | | | 21 | | | | 22 | | | | 23 Worldengine | 491-502 | |
There's a nice three volume gap there in 13-15 for the Simonson run inc the fills ins, the annuals, Baldar and possibly Avengers 249. Now I thought it unlikely the Epics would go there due to Masterworks being close but they're a little further off than I thought. The last issue in this year's Masterworks is 290. From there we can make a guess at what the next few Masterworks | Year | Volume | Last Issue? | | 2019 | 18 | 290 | | 2020 | 19 | 300 | | 2021 | 20 | 312 | | 2022 | 21 | 324 | | 2023 | 22 | 336 |
So at one modern Thor Epic per year we could get the whole Simonson run in in Epics before Masterworks get close. |
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Post by blueshift on May 6, 2019 20:12:28 GMT
What's the difference between the Masterworks and Epics?
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Post by The Doctor on May 6, 2019 20:43:39 GMT
Masterworks come out in issue order, Epics are released like a partworks series.
-Ralph
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Post by Pinwig on May 6, 2019 20:45:14 GMT
Ah. I was looking at this myself the other day. I'd worked out those three epic volumes would be reserved for the Simonson issues, but I couldn't work out the difference between the visionaries series and the by Walter Simonson books. That clears that up!
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Post by Philip Ayres on May 6, 2019 20:47:20 GMT
What's the difference between the Masterworks and Epics? Masterworks come out in issue order, Epics are released like a partworks series. -Ralph Masterworks are 10-12 issue Hardbacks, Epics are c20 issue paperbacks |
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Post by Philip Ayres on May 6, 2019 20:49:00 GMT
Ah. I was looking at this myself the other day. I'd worked out those three epic volumes would be reserved for the Simonson issues, but I couldn't work out the difference between the visionaries series and the by Walter Simonson books. That clears that up! To be clear, the original colours are the ones you want. And, judging by Kraven's Last Hunt, that should be what you get in the Epics. |
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Post by The Doctor on May 6, 2019 20:53:42 GMT
Kraven is now in the correct colours at last? Hooray!
Avoid the Simonson Thor recolours. Horrible murk.
-Ralph
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Post by Philip Ayres on May 6, 2019 20:56:52 GMT
Yes Kraven is correct in the Epic. We did draw your attention to it at the time!
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Post by The Doctor on May 6, 2019 20:57:57 GMT
It has slipped my mind!
-Ralph
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Post by Philip Ayres on May 6, 2019 21:00:23 GMT
ASM Epic Kraven's Last Hunt is here. ORIGINAL COLOURING! Massive result! |
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Post by Philip Ayres on May 10, 2019 17:47:03 GMT
Avengers Epic Collection: Fear The Reaper (finally) arrived today. My attention was drawn to this spread of Avengers covers, reprinted from the inside cover of Avengers #350:  So much so that I went and pulled Avengers #350 out the back issue box .... well the "to get rid of" box:  Ooops. |
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Post by Philip Ayres on May 15, 2019 7:52:55 GMT
Amazing Spider-Man Epic v19 Assassin Nation in comic shops today. Together with the existing volumes 17-18 and 20-22 that makes ASM the first epic to SIX consecutive volumes - issues 289-360, annuals 20-25
If v16 gets released then, with the existing v15, the run will be extended to EIGHT volumes - issues 159-360, annuals 18-25
Iron Man Epics 10-11 and 13-16 are out, the release of v12 would take them to a SEVEN volume run.
By the end of this year FF and Captain America (a volume in the middle) and Thor & X-Men (a volume on the end of 5 volume runs) will all be one volume shy of a six volume run
I await the 2020 listings with interest....
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Post by Philip Ayres on May 22, 2019 5:43:38 GMT
Silver Surfer Epic Collection v13: Inner Demons hits comic shops today. It's the 150th Epic Collection (122nd Marvel Universe Epic)
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Post by Philip Ayres on Jun 6, 2019 15:05:06 GMT
Amazing Spider-Man Epic v19 Assassin Nation in comic shops today. Together with the existing volumes 17-18 and 20-22 that makes ASM the first epic to SIX consecutive volumes - issues 289-360, annuals 20-25 What six consecutive Epics looks like: |
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Jim
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Post by Jim on Jun 6, 2019 17:46:27 GMT
I understand why they don’t, but it would be much more satisfying if they had the numbers on their spines
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