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Post by The Doctor on Mar 13, 2010 11:55:37 GMT
I'm puzzled by his comments that the seperate series are aimed at seperate ages/audiences, when previous publicity suggested they are meant to be fit together to get the 'big pictuire' of the new set-up. Bumblebee mini especially appears to literally spin out of pages of the ongoing storyline. Aiming them at different age ranges in that case seems, frankly, poorly observed. There's no problem with aiming series at different audiences if they are designed to be read completely seperately. No harm in that. Makes sense. But when they are linked...um, sorry I don't understand! I have to be honest, the editorial direction on this line is a constant puzzle for me over the last couple of years!
Anyway, the proviso still stands: read/buy what you enjoy.
-Ralph
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Post by Bogatan on Mar 13, 2010 12:09:00 GMT
So does that 8000 include the second run that was produced? If it does that would likely make a chunk of the difference. Afterall just because the first run sold out it didn't mean all the second run did and that would have affected how many of issue 2 were printed.
Andy
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Post by charlesrocketboy on Mar 13, 2010 12:59:00 GMT
Did... did I just see the editor of Wreckers slag off his own comic? Or, possibly, his own editing, since if he thinks it's "nigh impenetrable" there was nothing stopping him from going "hey R&R, can you change these bits" surely.
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Post by Jaymz on Mar 13, 2010 13:00:49 GMT
I order and sell more Wreckers in my shop than the other 2 titles. Bumblebee has been a bit of a stinker sales wise.
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Post by dinogrrl on Mar 13, 2010 19:58:28 GMT
Jesus what an asshole. Really, there's no other word for it. Ugh.
Edited: Alright, I found that my login still worked, so I posted exactly what I was thinking, thus ensuring a swift downward spiral to the thread, I'm sure, but bugger it that was a stupid comment for Schmidt to make. Even if he believed it, why the hell wouldn't they work just as hard to promote this series for the best possible sales?
Mindboggling.
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Post by charlesrocketboy on Mar 13, 2010 20:30:43 GMT
I just saw one of the mod's at TFArchive, the most critical and hard-to-please one of them all, remark about Wreckers: "HOLY **** WAS THAT AN ACTION SEQUENCE IN AN IDW COMIC? Did we take a ****ing break from people standing around monitors saying Big Captilaised Words at each other? Jesus H. Christ."
He loves it.
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Post by Benn on Mar 13, 2010 23:45:25 GMT
Yeah, the IDW boards are getting kinda tetchy with those of us who don't love everything Schmidt says. I'm tired of it, and I have no time for people quoting sales numbers at me to try and prove a point. Just when I was starting to feel comfortable posting there again.... Wreckers still rules, though!
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Post by Kingoji on Mar 14, 2010 8:21:49 GMT
Yeah, that's why I posted in retaliation to the sales numbers, saying that's an unfair comparison because they also reflect how many copies were in each title's print run, and also that LSotW LOST a load of copies in the delivery accident. I just think that Scmidt saying basically "Yeah, YOU like it, but no-one else will" is deeply offensive to the creative team on Wreckers, whether he meant it that way or not. And if he didn't, well... you'd think the editor for a comic book company would be better with wordings. @ Dinogrrrl; I love that sig you made up over there.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2010 10:56:31 GMT
I can't believe what Schmidt said in that post. His comments continue to baffle me. He slags off the people who are buying his comics, he slags off the first good comic they've made in a long while, he praises the rubbish and then he says at the end of that post 'let us know what you think we are getting right.'!
I'll tell him exactly what he's getting right. NOTHING!
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Post by Jaymz on Mar 14, 2010 11:51:24 GMT
Yeah, that's why I posted in retaliation to the sales numbers, saying that's an unfair comparison because they also reflect how many copies were in each title's print run, and also that LSotW LOST a load of copies in the delivery accident. Those sales numbers are based on Previews pre-orders. All the comic shops order the amount they want 2 months before the comic is due out, then the comic company will print to order with a percentage of overprint to allow for re-orders. The sales numbers quoted would be the print run and not the actual number of copies sold. They also only cover North America. The delivery accident wouldn't affect those numbers in any way, however they may affect the figures for the later issues as retailers would drop their order based on the lack of sales on issue 2 [because they didn't get it, or they got it late].
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Mar 14, 2010 12:09:28 GMT
Just curious - I'm sure someone has posted this information before, but what roughly were the circulation / print figures for the US and UK TF comics in the '80s/'90s?
What are the rough numbers for the TF comics currently in UK newsagents?
Ta!
Martin
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Post by jamesr on Mar 14, 2010 13:07:50 GMT
Yeah, that's why I posted in retaliation to the sales numbers, saying that's an unfair comparison because they also reflect how many copies were in each title's print run, and also that LSotW LOST a load of copies in the delivery accident. Those sales numbers are based on Previews pre-orders. All the comic shops order the amount they want 2 months before the comic is due out, then the comic company will print to order with a percentage of overprint to allow for re-orders. The sales numbers quoted would be the print run and not the actual number of copies sold. They also only cover North America. The delivery accident wouldn't affect those numbers in any way, however they may affect the figures for the later issues as retailers would drop their order based on the lack of sales on issue 2 [because they didn't get it, or they got it late]. Nick and I have known from early on that the predicted sales for this series were... modest. The print run for issue one (about 8,000) reflected that. The popularity of the series was such that a second printing was ordered. Because retailers order two months in advance of publication, and because retailers tend to reflexively reduce orders for a second issue, we arrived at 5,000 territory. We'd hoped that the sell out success of issue one would have been repeated with issue 2, but the accident has complicated things. The big concern is that fans will have looked for and failed to find issue two - without knowing the reasons - and by the time issue 3 comes out will decide they'd rather wait for the trade. Here's hoping that's not the case.
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Mar 14, 2010 13:57:13 GMT
Whereas #2 is nowhere to be seen. Cue the always friendly Steve Bax, who now has my money for issues 2 to 5 (all Hutch covers - I'm a stickler for consistency). FP Cardiff have lost me as a customer by failing to order the Nick cover for issue #2, so I've finally Googled to see what this Steve Bax fella people keep mentioning offers. Order now placed with him for 3A, 4A and 5A. Let's see what he can do! Martin
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Post by Jaymz on Mar 14, 2010 14:11:00 GMT
FP Cardiff have lost me as a customer by failing to order the Nick cover for issue #2 Actually, you don't get a choice which cover to order. The retailers are told that the cover split is 50/50 so you should receive half cover A for your order and half cover B. If the shop was not supplied correctly, the blame lies with Diamond, the distributor.
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Mar 14, 2010 14:20:32 GMT
I stand corrected. Anyway, the guy looked it up for me on his computer and said they'd only stocked four copies, all cover B. Off-topic, I spent a fair bit of time in French bookshops last week. They're very big indeed on comic books (band dessinee) and have massive sections devoted to it in bookshops and Virgin Megastores. Mostly hardback editions. Of the imported stuff, they're very big indeed on Star Wars graphic novels. I looked in each shop I went into to see what TF books had been translated into French. The only ones I found were French language versions of IDW's movie-based comics (Reign of Strascream, Revenge of the Fallen). I didn't buy them. Edit: Found a partial answer on-line to my question about sales figures in the 1980s.Martin
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Post by Bogatan on Mar 14, 2010 17:14:24 GMT
I vaguely remember in the UK comics wasn't there an ad pages or something that said place your ad here and be seen by amount x. I always remember it as either 25000 or 250000 per week. The first seems more likely, but if they meant all Marvel UK comics that week it could have been either.
Andy
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Post by Bogatan on Mar 14, 2010 18:04:24 GMT
I was tempted to register on IDW's site to ask this, but I figure with James and Nick and others on here I'm just as likely to get a decent answer.
Issue one gets 8000 copies printed as its expected to sell less than other series, but it sells out. How many reprints are produced and how long until they are on the book shelf?
In retrospect how many should have been produced and how will the lack of issues affect future issues sales?
If 1000-4000 fans weren't able to buy issue 1 will they get issue one when its reprinted, but if that takes 2 months (does that apply to reprints) then it's going to come out after issue three, by which point issue 2 with only 5000 issues will probably not be that easy to find. Nor will issue 3 if it came in similar numbers. By that point it seems that just waiting for the tpb will be the easiest option which seems like a bad thing for the whole runs sales figures.
Andy
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Post by blueshift on Mar 14, 2010 18:09:40 GMT
This is pretty much the problem with the whole comic industry as a whole due to Diamond's stranglehold on the market.
New, untested series find it really hard to get off the ground, since retailers must order 3 months in advance, so even if a series does fantastically well with readers, those sales only come into effect months down the line. Most retailers will chicken out of new series, leading to the deaths of many. See most of Marvel's latest new series that had lots of critical acclaim, but died quickly.
And of course, many publishers, especially small ones, are unwilling to sell directly from their own site, since those sales aren't recorded by Diamond, and Diamond's sales lists are what retailers use to see what is 'popular' and what is not.
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Mar 14, 2010 19:21:56 GMT
Obvious question from a comics industry ignoramus then, but if mini-series don't sell as well as an ongoing, why don't they scrap the mini-series model and have two ongoings instead, or a fortnightly ongoing, with the same material?
Martin
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Post by blueshift on Mar 14, 2010 19:35:37 GMT
I think that's why they've gone with an ongoing Martin, from their old model of lots of Miniseries. Trying to get the best of both worlds, as it is.
The thing is, on just about every single ongoing out there, the sales start high, and then dip in a steady decline. Companies like miniseries because issue 1s are easier to sell (most issue 1s get a huge boost in sales, which then tails off) and they entice people who might not want to be in for the long haul.
Personally, I think the model of an ongoing supported by a miniseries every so often is a good one. When it gets confusing is when you HAVE to read the miniseries to understand the ongoing as with the current Ongoing and Bumblebee. Or whatever the heck is going on with their GI Joe books.
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Post by Bogatan on Mar 14, 2010 19:40:35 GMT
I imagine because its selling on top of the ongoings sales. If they made it fortnightly to incorporate all the years issues and it kept its numbers one ongoing title with 24 issues per year would be better, but while they have only a monthly ongoing the mini series even at 5000 issues must make a profit or at least break even.
Also I think the minis draw in new customers like you and I, neither of us are likely to pick up the other series, at least not in a monthly format, but some will.
5000 per issue, 5 issues at $4 thats still $100,000 plus trade sales afterwards. I know IDW wont see most of that, but its not nothing.
Andy
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Post by dinogrrl on Mar 14, 2010 22:49:27 GMT
It's really disheartening to see such a drop, even if expected, but as James said, that accident may well have screwed sales for the rest of the run. Again, it doesn't help that IDW isn't doing much to help promote it either.
The fandom is working hard to promote it, but there's only so much we can do. If the company won't put in some effort, then yeah, it's going to lose sales more rapidly.
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Post by Bogatan on Mar 14, 2010 23:19:19 GMT
Dinogrrl were did your awesome sig go on the IDW thread? Not usually a big fan of them but that one was great.
Andy
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Post by charlesrocketboy on Mar 15, 2010 0:15:13 GMT
New, untested series find it really hard to get off the ground The really damning thing is that this isn't a new, untested series - it's a G1 Transformers miniseries, a long-running franchise with a fanbase (and an artist who's already produced Transformers work).
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Post by dinogrrl on Mar 16, 2010 4:18:22 GMT
Dinogrrl were did your awesome sig go on the IDW thread? Not usually a big fan of them but that one was great. Andy Andy that sig wasn't made by me, it was made by It's Walky over on the Allspark, I just borrowed it. Here's a copy of it, just credit Walky if you use it: So did they delete it from the thread over there at IDW? I only posted it once as a 'screw you' gesture, and haven't been back because I said what I wanted and don't expect an intelligent response.
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Post by Bogatan on Mar 16, 2010 4:28:47 GMT
It was there in the morning and gone in the evening. I think in fairness that thread has remain quite civil at least by IDW standards. If it wasn't being moderately informative I'd be disappointed.
Andy
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2010 11:45:37 GMT
I like that sig but its obvious it didn't sit well with the IDW editors. They think they can keep on making silly remarks without anybody correcting them or jumping on them over what they have said. As soon as someone does however, they get all arsey!
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