Transformers: The Definitive G1 Collection full release

[The Doctor]

Spotted in Asdaland so now out.

-Ralph

[Pinwig]

I must go in search of a cheap Target:2006 then and see how this measures up.

[The Huff]

I keep seeing this advertised on TV today. So strange seeing the iconic comic images moving around!

[blueshift]

I'm totally going to pick a few spare copies of this one as a gift to push proper Transformers comics on people. £2 for a hardback of Target: 2006 is rude to say no to!

[primenova]

... & with the face we where paying £20 for just Target 2006 14 years ago.

[Pinwig]

The new spine art is one the website now, half way down the front page:

www.transformerscollection.com/

[inflatabledalek]

For people after individual issues, when/if you can't find them in shops, this is the direct link to buy singles from Hachette (always worth keeping an eye on as the Who one will often have covers up for several months ahead even if you can't order them yet):

www.hachettepartworks.com/transformers-the-definitive-g1-collection

[Pinwig]

On the strength of this first book I'm not even sure I'm going to do that now. I will have to think about it. I have everything in other, better formats. A uniform collection would be nice, but it just isn't very good.

[Philip Ayres]

M submits the following:

[inflatabledalek]

And of course, they've changed the spine art just enough that non-subscribers who picked up the trial issues will have to buy again to get a matching set, but still not fixed any of the issues people who didn't like it had!

[The Doctor]

They have us by the balls!

THE CYBER BALLS!

-Ralph

[Philip Ayres]

They'll be other tweaks. I can't see The Underbase being split up.

[Fortmax2020]

I'm happy with what they're doing. Of course there will be different ways of doing things that we the 'elite' fans would like them to do but we're not the target market and frankly we border too much on a sense of entitlement for Transformer merchandise and products these days.

Would we rather not have these at all??

[Grand Moff Muffin]

Dec 31, 2016 0:44:28 GMT Fortmax2020 said:

Would we rather not have these at all??

By that argument nobody should criticise the Michael Bay movies either (or indeed Rogue One).

People just don't like to see opportunities wasted to do something better.

If you always settle for 'better than nothing' or 'good enough' then where's the incentive for excellence? People giving feedback should set standards high, as long as they acknowledge that's what they're doing.

We should celebrate best practice - like the hardback Titan collections of the US series, which were perfectly cleaned up versions of the originals. It would be an insult to those for fans to be equally satisfied with the IDW scans being repeated in a series that calls itself 'Definitive'.

And not checking proofs at the most basic level so that a picture of Prowl appears in the guide to who's who alongside Jazz's text...

The price of £1.99 makes the first volume value for money regardless - but they'll be making a loss on it.

Martin

[inflatabledalek]

I'm sure newer younger fans have given feedback as well, and they're just as entitled to do so. But Hachette won't know what they can do better unless they get a lot of folks thought (and let's face it, the majority of those already committed to spending the full 800 quid over 3 years are the Entitled Super Fans. Especially as the trial didn't make capital of the newer more contemporary stuff that might draw in non old farts like us, I do think they should have done one book more recent than the last ten years in that regard).

And Hachette do listen. The big complaint about the Who one was the incredibly inept proof reading. Sentences cut off in the middle, repeated information, the format of the cover text (is it "Story" or "Stories"), enough people moaned though that they did sort the problem out and for most of this year have paid the intern who checks these things a bit more to do a better job of it.

Obviously it's too late to do something about the spines (though if they know people like Ralph aren't buying because of that it might save some other partwork that indignity!), but reproduction of the strips, how the UK/US differences are handled and any potential Jazz/Prowl errors could all potentially be dealt with as the series goes along. Telling them what we think they can do better is helpful--especially at this early stage--rather than damaging.

I'd have no problem with them ditching the stock images for the front cover and commissioning new character portraits (or if the budget assigned to the thing requires reuse of material, start grabbing stuff from the Dreamwave guide book which has least a wider variety of characters to pick from and less flat colouring) that were a bit more dynamic and allow for more relevance to the content.

And it's worth remembering people wouldn't be hung up on the "Marvel in order" thing if that wasn't the exact thing Furman had said the series would be doing.

[The Doctor]

Dec 31, 2016 0:44:28 GMT Fortmax2020 said:

I'm happy with what they're doing. Of course there will be different ways of doing things that we the 'elite' fans would like them to do but we're not the target market and frankly we border too much on a sense of entitlement for Transformer merchandise and products these days.

Would we rather not have these at all??

There's no sense of 'entitlement' when considered critiques are made. I had no aware I was of an 'elite' or 'entitled'. Can't we have good natured discussion/differing opinions without name calling? There are other parts of the internet for that.

Criticisms that I would consider as unfair would be the pricepoint and physical book production.

-Ralph

[Fortmax2020]

There was no name calling.

I just strongly object when I hear fans telling companies what they should or must do or how they just get things wrong etc. Particularly when it is rarely balanced with praising positives. There's a fine line on constructive feedback to companies that make products we chose to buy and we are well on the wrong side of it these days.

It has been a feature creeping into more and more discussions on this forum in the last few months that we used to be proud of not sharing with other boards but now we seem to not just tolerate it but are embracing it.

As for legitimate disagreements.. yes we should have them and we used to but we don't seem to be very good at that either any more.

[Grand Moff Muffin]

I can produce abundant evidence that I have always been overly critical of the things companies do and overly sparing in my praise for them. I refer you to exhibit A, being my adult life.

Martin

[Pinwig]

Dec 31, 2016 9:56:05 GMT Fortmax2020 said:

I just strongly object when I hear fans telling companies what they should or must do or how they just get things wrong etc. Particularly when it is rarely balanced with praising positives. There's a fine line on constructive feedback to companies that make products we chose to buy and we are well on the wrong side of it these days.

I have no feeling of entitlement. My comments were evaluative. I need to evaluate whether I want to buy these books, and I'm vocalising my thoughts on a forum discussing that. My personal question is whether I want these books when I have the contents in better formats elsewhere, but I'm not telling anyone else not to buy them or denigrating their choice to do so. It's great that these exist and if I didn't have multiple copies of the stories already I'd be 100% subscribed. 

I did say I see what they've done any why they've done it, but this is an £800 collection so it isn't unreasonable to make comment about the quality - how does anyone improve anything without feedback or comment? All I was saying was that in comparison to the way the Dredd books have been done, these aren't quite in the same league. The paper, finish and quality of the physical product is excellent, it's just a shame the money wasn't available to resource and remaster the pages from scratch. There is an army of fans with collections who could help with that, as I believe Jaymz does with the UK Classics books.

It has been a feature creeping into more and more discussions on this forum in the last few months that we used to be proud of not sharing with other boards but now we seem to not just tolerate it but are embracing it.

I don't think so. If we all sat an applauded everything in the world of Transformers without any criticism there'd be no conversation. For every negative point there's usually a positive, and rational discussion with it. These boards are a world away from any other I've read. The difference is massive. The Hub is awesome. 

[Andy Turnbull]

Dec 31, 2016 9:56:05 GMT Fortmax2020 said:

There was no name calling.

I just strongly object when I hear fans telling companies what they should or must do or how they just get things wrong etc. Particularly when it is rarely balanced with praising positives. There's a fine line on constructive feedback to companies that make products we chose to buy and we are well on the wrong side of it these days.

It has been a feature creeping into more and more discussions on this forum in the last few months that we used to be proud of not sharing with other boards but now we seem to not just tolerate it but are embracing it.

As for legitimate disagreements.. yes we should have them and we used to but we don't seem to be very good at that either any more.

I have to disagree with pretty much everything you have said. If I buy something I am perfectly within my rights to say what I liked and alao what could be done better. Given they ran a trial of the partworks, it is not unreasonable if we have pointed out things that might be done tonikprove the overall quality then if these are not done which Hachette are perfectky entitled to not do then we are quite within our rights to voice our dissatisfaction.

We sadly won't see the Titan repro again, simply as these were not physical assets but digital files so the chances are that when the license went from Titan they deleted the files. So we are using the IDW masters now. Now when iDW collected Target 2006 in trade they left the masthead in there and we gave them pelters for it there, just as we gave them pelters for the Continuum one shot, just as we gave them pelters for the shrunken repro of the UK classics, just as we gave them praise for the backmatter in said volumes.

If I think something is below par I will say so, doesn't make me elite it just means I am not happy with settling. Just as several on the board have criticised the recolours whereas I have championed them. Pretty sure these were reasonable disagreements.

Andy

[Pinwig]

Dec 31, 2016 0:44:28 GMT Fortmax2020 said:

I'm happy with what they're doing. Of course there will be different ways of doing things that we the 'elite' fans would like them to do but we're not the target market

I dunno about that. Look at the big selling points they're using for this - Specially produced covers, exclusive bonus content, collectible spines and all stories in order. At £20 a month if the core market for this isn't older Transformers fans like us then I'm not sure who it's aimed at. It's pushing the buttons of collectors completely. Casual fans aren't going to sign up to an £800 collection simply for nostalgia reasons and kids won't recognise the characters because this isn't movie or RiD. Would the 'teens getting into Generations toys because they liked RiD/Prime when they were younger' audience be big enough to support something like this on its own? Unless you're dedicated to the cause these stories probably won't mean anything. I remember when Major Spoilers, a respected comics podcast, reviewed Last Stand of the Wreckers. They rubbished it because outside the world of Transformers fandom it made no sense. I know that was a real hardcore fan aimed story, but for the casual magazine buyer in Smiths most of these stories will be. 
  

[Jaymz]

Dec 31, 2016 7:55:44 GMT Grand Moff Muffin said:

We should celebrate best practice - like the hardback Titan collections of the US series, which were perfectly cleaned up versions of the originals.

They started well, but they're really shoddy by the end. Dark Star has awful reproduction, which is a shame as most of the other volumes are so good. Still better than the IDW Classics reproduction though.

[Andy Turnbull]

If memory serves me partway through the Titan run one of the staff responsible for the TF books left, which might account for the change in quality at the end.

Andy

[Bogatan]

On a mostly unrelated note, but I mentioned in the other partworks thread that seeing it in Asda I couldnt resist picking it up despite having the trial version and subscribing.

It got me thinking that I used to get the comic from one or two local newsagents and that I wanted to see if it was available in a local newsagent. I then had to think where my nearest newsagents was.

20-25 years ago I can count at least 12 (probably closer to 20) of them within 1-2miles of my house in any direction. Almost all of them have gone now. The few that are still more or less the same, less than half, are mostly now classed as convenience stores or corner shops or Off Licenses. Only one still calls itself a newsagents and even that Newsagents and Off License.

Its one of those old man questions I can add to my list, like when did Chemists stop being called Chemists?

Anyway that one newsagents is down the local high Street that I got most of my TFUK from, but never I think from that newsagents. I went and had a look it did have one copy of the Definitive Collection left so I bought it.

[Andy Turnbull]

Of course I picked up a copy when I saw it in WH Smiths today.

So many newsagents in my neck of the woods have gone. There used to be loads, when I was buying comics from them before i discovered speciality stores I would often go on a walk for a few hours and do the circuit of them.

Andy

[The Doctor]

Distribution on this appears to be poor in my area. I've seen 3 (waterlogged) copies in one Asdaland. Nowt in other supermarkets, WH Smiths or newsagents. Even my local newsagent of joy (which gets in most UK newsstand comics other than Commando) didn't get it in.

-Ralph

[blueshift]

Jan 1, 2017 20:13:29 GMT The Doctor said:

Distribution on this appears to be poor in my area. I've seen 3 (waterlogged) copies in one Asdaland. Nowt in other supermarkets, WH Smiths or newsagents. Even my local newsagent of joy (which gets in most UK newsstand comics other than Commando) didn't get it in.

-Ralph

I had to hunt about my WH Smiths. They weren't with the other magazines but in a seperate standee box by the checkouts

[Andy Turnbull]

Jan 1, 2017 20:26:16 GMT blueshift said:

Jan 1, 2017 20:13:29 GMT The Doctor said:

Distribution on this appears to be poor in my area. I've seen 3 (waterlogged) copies in one Asdaland. Nowt in other supermarkets, WH Smiths or newsagents. Even my local newsagent of joy (which gets in most UK newsstand comics other than Commando) didn't get it in.

-Ralph

I had to hunt about my WH Smiths. They weren't with the other magazines but in a seperate standee box by the checkouts

That is where they are in my WH Smiths as well.

[kinggrimlock]

Dec 31, 2016 8:29:59 GMT inflatabledalek said:

And Hachette do listen. The big complaint about the Who one was the incredibly inept proof reading. Sentences cut off in the middle, repeated information, the format of the cover text (is it "Story" or "Stories"), enough people moaned though that they did sort the problem out and for most of this year have paid the intern who checks these things a bit more to do a better job of it.

Sorry to take this thread off topic, but at what point do the problems with the Doctor Who collection cease? I slightly regret not subscribing to it, as I would have loved the "bonus" Graphic Novels that were part of the enhanced subscription, but I've just been cherry picking the 2nd & 6th Doctor ones instead. Reason I ask and hijack this thread temporarily is I notice that the Hachette website is having a 50% off sale at the moment and so all the Who, Marvels and Dredds are only £5 each. I might grab some of the Who ones but I'd sooner avoid the ones that have problems.

Bringing it back on topic - those of you who aren't bothered about subscribing to the TF Generation 1 collection might want to wait until next January. Not sure if Hachette do this every year, but you might be able to pick up everything (so far) half price if you do!

Thanks for any info.

[Bogatan]

Argh! I hate sales like this. Makes me feel foolish paying full price when next year I can/could pick up a full years run for £120 next January.