Can a Transformer use another's Binary Bonded Partner?

[Philip Ayres]

The WFC Siege images of Op & Sideswipe both using Firedrive got me thinking:

What's to stop a Transformer from using another Transformer's Targetmaster? The connection seems to be less solid than for a Headmaster & Powermaster, both of which are physically attached: A Targetmaster is just held.

Yet in the Headmasters Japanese cartoon series we see head swapping going on.

Do we ever see a Targetmaster being used by a different TF in Fiction? Are there any other examples of a TF using another's binary bonded partner?

(BURNS: LEAVE "ONE TRANSFORMER TOY CANNOT USE ANOTHER'S WEAPONS" AT THE DOOR, THANK YOU!)

[Fortmax2020]

Nightbeat used that corpse back in TFUK I believe.

[Fortmax2020]

Also Head/Target/Powermaster Nebulans could all be swapped between their relevant colleagues in toy form right? Probably where the Headmasters show got the idea.

CANON.

[blueshift]

Poll! Poll!

[The Doctor]

No, Phil, no!

-Ralph

[Philip Ayres]

I suspected you might have trouble with this one hence

Jul 17, 2018 8:23:25 GMT Philip Ayres said:

(BURNS: LEAVE "ONE TRANSFORMER TOY CANNOT USE ANOTHER'S WEAPONS" AT THE DOOR, THANK YOU!)

[The Doctor]

I'm going by the tech specs, Phil. The tech specs on the toy packaging!!! Also the individual toy packaging itself. It's quite clear. There are even pictures.

-Ralph

[The Doctor]

For example, Firebolt goes with Hot Rod as the toy packaging tells us this. Firebolt does not go philandering with Kup, for instance.

-Ralph

[Andy Turnbull]

I'd say that both Target and Powermasters could be interchangeable, although in the Marvel run it does become clear that the Powermaster process does result in something else as the two are moving towards one-ness. Something that the Headmaster process doesn't quite deliver. We see a continual fight between the two parties for dominance. So perhaps a suitably mentally powerful Nebulan or Transformer could bond with someone else's partner.

Andy

[Philip Ayres]

I cold see a Targetmaster refusing to be fired by another TF though....

[primenova]

Uk issue where the Constructicons give each other their guns

[Philip Ayres]

Constructicon guns aren't Targetmasters though are they pete?

[legios]

Jul 17, 2018 8:23:25 GMT Philip Ayres said:

What's to stop a Transformer from using another Transformer's Targetmaster? The connection seems to be less solid than for a Headmaster & Powermaster, both of which are physically attached: A Targetmaster is just held.

Yet in the Headmasters Japanese cartoon series we see head swapping going on.

Japanese Headmasters are a fundamentally different thing from Western Headmasters though. For a start there is no "Binary Bonding" process, because the larger robot bodies are non-sentient. There is only a single individual, and that is the micromaster-sized robots. They turn into heads which are able to merge with the larger forms and operate them, but it is in the same sense that someone climbing into the cockpit of a Patlabor, or sitting in drivers seat of a car controls them - they are piloting a non-sentient vehicle. (It is closer to a direct-neural linkage in terms of the speed of reaction time, and the depth of integration between pilot and vehicle than simply working the controls, but fundamentally that is all it is).

The Godmaster process is similar in some respects, but differs in others. The Transtectors appear to be non-sentient in a similar way to a Headmaster's body, but they appear to be paired with specific pairs of Masterbracers. It is the Masterbracers which appear to allow a human to assume a form which can link with the Transtector shell. The available evidence would suggest that the Masterbracers are attuned to a specific Transtector, and become attuned to a specific human being on being donned. This would suggest that a Godmaster may not be able to merge with a different Transtector than the one to which they are attuned. (That said, the Godmaster process is as much a spiritual one as it is a technological one - given that it appears intimately connected to the ability to manipulate and harness Qi, so I think that a much greater understanding of taoist thought would need to be acquired before I would want to pronounce on that with any finality).

So arguably, as neither the Japanese Headmasters or Godmasters use the Binary Bonding process, it could be said that they aren't really enterable in evidence regarding it.

Karl

[legios]

Jul 17, 2018 19:30:47 GMT Philip Ayres said:

Constructicon guns aren't Targetmasters though are they pete?

I think that Pete is addressing the broader point of Transformers being able to use their manipulators to operate a variety of weapons, and indicating an instance in which the fiction demonstrates Transformers using guns more often used by another Transformer.

Karl

[primenova]

Also those guns must have had a tracking device in them for them to be passed from one to the other. But this would be more advanced in a targetmaster gun

[Fortmax2020]

Surely we must turn to the toys themselves as the baseline indicator here? Can the toys swap heads/guns/engines? Yes they can. Indeed it is a fundamental play feature. It is surely irrelevant to the question if various fictional derivatives have chosen to use this or not? In fact it could make for some interesting future plot points...

[Grand Moff Muffin]

What do people reckon happened to Fracas after Scourge got sucked up into the Time Wars rift?

Martin

[Pinwig]

Retired to Cromer and bought an ice cream van.

[Andy Turnbull]

Well without Nightstick who'd been his chum up till that point as well who knows? He could have signed up with Scorponok and his lot, but I think you'd have spotted him by now.

Maybe he tried to get away from the war? After all he'd seen Nightstick get destroyed and of course what happened to Cyclonus.

[Grand Moff Muffin]

Jul 18, 2018 21:57:36 GMT Andy Turnbull said:

Maybe he tried to get away from the war? After all he'd seen Nightstick get destroyed and of course what happened to Cyclonus.

Fracas was last seen in the Decepticons' fortress base in Oregon, while Scorponok was based in New York, a continent away. Fracas ran the risk of being charged as a deserter anyway, so I doubt he'd try to go back. But it would be interesting to see him trying to get on in Earth society. Would he discard his armour or hang onto it somehow, on the offchance that the ability to turn into an incendiary cannon would come in handy one day?

Bob Budiansky never wrote a Universe entry for Targetmaster Scourge so we know less about him than most Nebulans, only that he has a volatile temper (from the tech-specs).

I guess he could always try to get a movie job like Skullgrin.

Martin

[Andy Turnbull]

Or would Blackrock or Triple III look to get him? What about Centurion, still lying there in the Fortress Base as well...

[Grand Moff Muffin]

Jul 18, 2018 23:09:37 GMT Andy Turnbull said:

Or would Blackrock or Triple III look to get him?

How would they know he was allied to the Deceps? He could just claim to have been captured and experimented on by them against his will.

Then there's also the Nebulans of Needlenose and Spinister. What would they have done after Carnivac killed their robots? Or did the Autobots separate them from the Decepticons when they were captured on the Ark at the end of the Matrix Quest? (The Targetmaster guns were clearly visible in the Longtooth / Moby Dick issue, but not in the UK strips.) We know far more about them than we do about Fracas. Here's what the Marvel comic told us about them:

Needlenose is binary-bonded to the Nebulans, Zigzag and Sunbeam. Zigzag was an unhappy hovercraft repairman on Nebulos. His inability to properly use a laser welder made him particularly ill-suited for his job. Usually the vehicles that he was assigned to repair were worse off after he worked on them. His fellow workers ridiculed him for his ineptitude. They derisively called him "Ziggy" rather than his real name. Seeing an alliance with the Decepticons as a way to get even with his tormentors, he eagerly offered his services to the leader of the Nebulos-based Decepticons, Scorponok, who happily accepted him into the ranks of his warriors. After putting him through the bio-engineering process, Scorponok paired him with Needlenose. The Nebulan gave himself the code name "Zigzag," which he thought sounded strong and put an ironic twist to his insulting nickname. However, the Decepticons soon found his services to be as wanting as had the Nebulans.

Sunbeam was an irresponsible beach bum on Nebulos before he discovered the Decepticons. His greatest ambition was to go rocket-surfing on the 50-foot tall waves that occurred annually on his home planet's Magna Beach. But, having accomplished that, he needed new challenges. So, for the opportunity to rocket-surf on other worlds, he joined the Decepticons and underwent bio-engineering. He was then paired with Needlenose and trained in aerial combat. He views the warrior aspect of his job as a necessary nuisance. He says, "If I have to scrap a few 'Bots so I can ride the Mercury Breakers on Cybertron, well like, hey, no problem, dude."

Zigzag transforms into a twin electrostatic overloader rifle, which can disable a mechanical opponent by flooding his circuits with a surge of electricity, causing him to overload and shut down. Some of his victims even explode. However, Zigzag's accuracy is poor, so most targets escape unscathed. Sunbeam converts to a solar-powered light-burst discharger. A flash from his muzzle causes temporary blindness in all opponents except those whose optical modules are properly shielded.

Spinister is binary-bonded to two Nebulans, Singe and Hairsplitter. Singe was the playboy son of one of Nebulos's leading families. He signed up with the Decepticons soon after he publicly declared his sympathies were with Lord Zarak in his struggle against Zarak's Nebulan rival, Galen, and the Autobots. Singe was motivated by his feelings for Zarak's daughter, Llyra, whose affections he had lost years earlier to Galen. He saw the opportunity to destroy Galen as his chance to win her back. But once he went into exile with his fellow Decepticon-allied Nebulans he had no opportunity to put his theory into effect, leaving him a bitter, lonely hate-filled warrior.

Hairsplitter is just happy to be in an organization in which he feels wanted. On Nebulos he was an ecological efficiency expert whose job primarily consisted of writing memos that pinpointed waste in the Nebulos Department of the Environment and assigned blame to those bureaucrats responsible for the waste. He was not very popular among his co-workers. He agreed to undergo the bio-engineering process that would binary bond him to Spinister when Lord Zarak told him that his talent for spotting slackers would be welcomed by Scorponok, commander of the contingent of Decepticons on Nebulos.

Singe converts to a double-barrelled nuclear-powered flamethrower. He can adjust the heat in his flame so that he can do anything from lightly toasting a target at temperatures in the 140 degrees Fahrenheit range to melting an enemy Autobot into a pool of slag at temperatures up to 3200 degrees. Hairsplitter converts to twin lock-target laser rifles. He is renowned for his accuracy and has been known to etch his name on a microchip positioned two miles away with his laser beams.

A double-barrelled nuclear-powered flamethrower?! Blimey, money talks. Singe was rich and got that gig. Sunbeam was a beach bum and got to transform into a flashlight.

Peacemaker was a Nebulan law enforcement officer. Maybe when the war was over he set about rounding up all the surviving Nebulans who had joined the Decepticons and shipped them back to Nebulos to stand trial?

Martin

[Fortmax2020]

How do we know Fracas *wasn't* an unwilling subject experimented on by the Decepticons?

And what if he couldn't remove his armour? It always seemed odo to me that the Autobot Powermaster Nebulans did on occasion.

[Grand Moff Muffin]

Jul 19, 2018 6:55:45 GMT Fortmax2020 said:

How do we know Fracas *wasn't* an unwilling subject experimented on by the Decepticons?

Fair point. Maybe that's why TM Scourge's tech-specs describe him as an angry person.

And what if he couldn't remove his armour? It always seemed odo to me that the Autobot Powermaster Nebulans did on occasion.

And Headmasters (Spike).

The Autobots are nice, so I'm sure they'd enable their Nebulans to be able to remove their bulky armour.

The Decepticons... dunno. Depends how much say the Nebulans had in the process, I guess.

Martin

[blueshift]

Jul 19, 2018 7:01:15 GMT Grand Moff Muffin said:

Jul 19, 2018 6:55:45 GMT Fortmax2020 said:

How do we know Fracas *wasn't* an unwilling subject experimented on by the Decepticons?

Fair point. Maybe that's why TM Scourge's tech-specs describe him as an angry person.

And what if he couldn't remove his armour? It always seemed odo to me that the Autobot Powermaster Nebulans did on occasion.

And Headmasters (Spike).

The Autobots are nice, so I'm sure they'd enable their Nebulans to be able to remove their bulky armour.

The Decepticons... dunno. Depends how much say the Nebulans had in the process, I guess.

Martin

I like to think they stored their armour in subspace and could god-on it

[Fortmax2020]

I always put Spike's armour being removable down to it being 'second generation' armour and not built under the pressure and time constraints the original five had to be upgraded under.

And also a bit of a naff idea to make the snow battle story work.

[Grand Moff Muffin]

Methinks it's time for a little binary-bonding fanfiction.

tmukhub.proboards.com/thread/9876/last-days-transformers-war?page=2&scrollTo=326778

Martin