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Post by The Doctor on Nov 13, 2016 18:48:59 GMT
Optimus and Sentinel Primes are in CW/TR. For all we know Prime Wars just means a war with those chaps. Who knows! Time will tell.
As an aside, has 'Prime Wars' been used on any CW/TR packaging? I had assumed it was just an internal Hasbro title but I'm sure Machinima used the name on their CW series that, er, they deleted from their own youtube channel not long after it was put up.
-Ralph
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Post by Kingoji on Nov 13, 2016 19:34:54 GMT
Even if it were the 13, we've still got the rest of the line to fill.
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Post by Llama God on Nov 13, 2016 21:05:35 GMT
Repaints!
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Post by Toph on Nov 13, 2016 21:07:56 GMT
Optimus and Sentinel Primes are in CW/TR. For all we know Prime Wars just means a war with those chaps. Who knows! Time will tell. As an aside, has 'Prime Wars' been used on any CW/TR packaging? I had assumed it was just an internal Hasbro title but I'm sure Machinima used the name on their CW series that, er, they deleted from their own youtube channel not long after it was put up. -Ralph It has not been, but it's more official/not as internal as "Aligned," "Beast Era," or "movie" Unicron Trilogy was never used on any packaging, but that is the full official title of that era. Prime Wars seems to be more with this mindset. |
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Post by blueshift on Nov 13, 2016 21:12:14 GMT
I'm sure 'Unicron trilogy' was used on some of the Universe packaging? It was used a lot by Hasbro and fans around the time of Cybertron, or am I misremembering (as calling it a trilogy assumed it finishes at 3 shows whereas I assume the original plan was just to keep going with it)
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 13, 2016 21:14:35 GMT
If I was a betting man I'd say Micromasters, with TR compatible base ramps & 84-6 Micromasters and Micromasters in Pretenders, which would get the Pretender figures down small enough to work. Expanding.... As has been said I can't see Prime Wars 3 being just 13 warring Primes. That ain't gonna fill a line. What Combiner Wars & Titans return have in common is a central gimmick. So I think it's likely PW3 will also have a gimmick. Western Transformers Gimmicks Combination - done in Combiner Wars
Headmasters - done in Titans Return
Targetmasters
Powermasters
Micromasters
Pretenders Targetmasters & Powermasters seem unlikely. Both are lesser gimmicks to Headmasters and both have had their primary characters milked by Titans Return I think some combination (haha) of Pretenders & Micromasters is most likely. They're the two biggest G1 gimmicks no done and one, Micromasters, would lend itself to doing the other, Pretenders, at deluxe size which is the centre for most lines. The Micromasters would be Titanmaster (head robot) size enabling the Titanmaster (small robot and vehicle/creature) assortment to continue I can also see both elements being done as a "Classic" thing with small 84-6 G1 character Micromasters and classic Pretender. Voyagers I could see being used for Pretenders which Transform. Ditto Leeaders, which I see similar to present forming bases for the little figures. Same ramp & footpeg systems as now allowing cross line compatability. |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 13, 2016 21:18:04 GMT
I'm sure 'Unicron trilogy' was used on some of the Universe packaging? Unicron BATTLES was the redress of the Armada Line in it's later stages |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 13, 2016 21:19:36 GMT
I wouldn't say no to a new Universe repaints line. |
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Post by blueshift on Nov 13, 2016 21:22:25 GMT
I'm sure 'Unicron trilogy' was used on some of the Universe packaging? Unicron BATTLES was the redress of the Armada Line in it's later stages Just checked my Universe Hot Shot, it does call it 'the Unicron Trilogy' though this was 2009 so wow, 5 years after the fact |
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Post by Pinwig on Nov 13, 2016 22:17:04 GMT
Pretenders sounds too expensive to me. Robot AND shell? They'd have to be tiny on the current budget. I'd be tempted say Beast Wars is more likely because it's more practical, but that's a gamble on the nostalgia appeal front. Micromasters feels to me like it's being done in TR. There has to be diminishing returns in these gimmicks; far fewer people were buying Transformers in 89/90 than they were the years before.
13 Primes is a dead end I think. That's an aligned continuity/movie thing.
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 13, 2016 22:33:29 GMT
John Warden, the man in charge of the Generations Line, is on record as not being a BW fan which is why I think Beast Wars, and the Beast Combiner Rumour, looks unlikely.
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Post by Pinwig on Nov 13, 2016 23:06:10 GMT
I think whatever it is, it will fit the current scale set. Everything adapted to fit Titanmasters in, but they were careful not to alter the existing sizes. That's why I don't think Pretenders will work, because it doesn't fit. Unless you did the shells as Voyagers and the robots as Deluxes, but then you're selling Transformers that don't transform.
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 13, 2016 23:16:27 GMT
The inner robots as Titanmaster sized Micromasters is the only way I see it working.
Non TFing deluxe shells, TF ing Voyager and Leader shells
Flip down chests to accommodate the inner robot.
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Post by Toph on Nov 14, 2016 2:22:27 GMT
13 Primes is a dead end I think. That's an aligned continuity/movie thing. It isn't. The 13 originated as far back as G2. It was DW G1 continuity that it really started to take shape, and it's the central premise behind IDW G1's colony worlds. Aligned was to be Hasbro's focus for their 13 fanfics, but as Aligned is dead in the water, they need a new dumping ground for it. |
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Post by Toph on Nov 14, 2016 3:43:16 GMT
This is just taking a stab in the dark. But it's the general fandom belief that everything we see gets tested in the previous line. It's believed Gen Brainstorm was a dry run for Titanmasters. It's believed something was a dry run for CW, but I'll be damned if i know what that is. Fandom logic perplexes me.
However, everyone is looking to what g1 gimmick will be universally updated and forced across the entire line.
Why does it have to be a G1 gimmick? That's an awful narrow scope. Powermasters and Targetmasters were thrown under the bus by converting them entirely to headmasters.
Micromasters would be too similar to what's going on with TM and the more broadly appealing Minicons.
As has been pointed out, Pretenders just don't work in this day an age. Not in the way that would please everyone. Not in a way that's marketable.
Actionmasters, well, "WUTS THE POINT OF A TF TAHT DONT TF!?!???one?!! GEEWUN WAZ RUINED FOREVAR!!11!!1!" -Geewunners
Anyway, if the fan belief that the new line gimmick is tested in the previous, then I think Blaster is it. Smaller size classes in the service of a larger toy.
I still think The 13 Primes is enough to build the central theme around, easily. You got all of them, which hasbro has said for years they want to do. Plus Optimus Prime, Rodimus Prime, Sentinel Prime, Zeta Prime/Nemesis Prime, Longarm Prime, the "primes" from Cybertron. There are the idw colony leaders.
That's 25+ potential characters. And only Optimus and Sentinel have had recent toys.
How can this translate into linewide gimmick? Well, Primes are known for their mystical items. Optimus has his Creation Matrix. Nova/Nemesis has his Dead Matrix. Solas has her hammer. Vector has his sword and Safeguard.
There's no reason these can't be worked into the overall theme and gimmick.
Then there's Blaster/Soundwave. There's also the possibility that subservient legends will be expanded on.
This may could even tie into the legendary items.
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Post by Llama God on Nov 14, 2016 8:09:01 GMT
Hmmm. Interesting.
Now, I would dearly *love* for the next line to contain Pretenders. And they could work, cost effectively - a non-transforming deluxe-sized action figure (that doesn't have to split in two, just an opening torso or something) with a Titanmaster/Minicon "pilot" would easily fit in the current price range for deluxes. But then I also don't see how that would fit into the "Primes" thing at all. Unless you want to go with "Pretender to the throne of the Primes", and I don't think they'd base a whole line on a terrible pun...
So yeah, considering that we've already had two Optimus Primes in this line, 25 Primes could easily fill out an entire line, with, I guess, the "original" Primes being the larger size classes? I dunno. But something like that. And then the "usual" classic characters - 'Bee, Starscream, etc. - being represented at Legends sizes, and with the gimmick being artifacts... that could definitely work. And I'd like to see that.
I think that the only thing that would argue against something like a "unique artifact"-based gimmick system though is the lack of retool-ability. Clearly the reason that Titan Masters and indeed Combiner Wars worked was because they were able to easily re-use the same basic tooling again and again (and I'm talking now in terms of CAD modelling and how the figures were designed to work). If each figure had its own gimmick, then the potential for tooling re-use decreases dramatically. But on the other hand, I'm not an engineer, so I know nothing. As such, we can remain hopeful... :-)
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Post by Kingoji on Nov 14, 2016 8:45:34 GMT
The RID cartoon and IDW books have both pushed the Micronus Prime character lately, come to think of it. And it's worth noting that fiction-wise both CW and TR's gimmicks have come from the power of Nexus Prime. And there *is* Onyx Prime as well, "Lord of Beasts", who in IDW has already been introduced as a concept, being at war with the followers of other Primes.
Also don't forget that Alpha Trion is a Prime, so that's another already done.
I think bringing up the likes of Longarm Prime is reaching though, otherwise don't forget Cliffjumper Prime!
Speaking of Animated, I would like to see them do another version of Sentinel which more closely resembles that version.
Back to the Pretenders/Beasts things though. It could work, if you accept that, just as TR has, different gimmicks are merged as a new one. Maybe the deluxe scale will do G1 Pretenders characters in the same way that they did the first Beast wars toys; a regular robot mode that converts into the shell he used to have (think how IDW updated Carnivac, for example, but instead the 'beast' mode is a bipedal monster). The Voyager scale could be used to do something more traditional (Legends class in a more articulated shell, best candidate Bludgeon). The Leader class being a deluxe guy with a transforming shell (Thunderwing).
That's just a possibility though. Personally I'd like to see an eventual complete set of updated, Voyager, G1 Dinobots.
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Post by The Doctor on Nov 14, 2016 12:50:56 GMT
Imagine how crazy it would be if PART III was based around the forgotten gimmick of...COLOUR CHANGE!
THE RETURN OF DELUGE AND CHUMS!
BUT THIS TIME...
EVERYONE IS A DELUGE!
-Ralph
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Post by Philip Ayres on Nov 14, 2016 12:54:07 GMT
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Post by The Doctor on Nov 14, 2016 12:55:08 GMT
That's why we have to fire water at him TO REVEAL HIS IDENTITY!
-Ralph
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Post by Bogatan on Nov 14, 2016 13:47:17 GMT
Pretenders as an evolution of TR seems perfectly reasonable. PMOP/Ultra Magnus and Blaster could already be reused as Pretenders with no changes, well a face on to Blasters head and the inner robot cant stay in the shell in vehicle mode for Prime and Magnus, but still they work.
Blaster especially works well as any legend made to rewinds data pad dimensions fits. It wouldnt be hard to make simple Voyager sized moulds that could fit rewind sized blocks in their torsos either.
At Deluxe size all the CW moulds could be used as shells for TR sized robots by scooping out the combiner port gimmick admittedly at TR size theres would be much range of transformation.
CW Silverbolt with Superion head scooped out would allow something closer to legends sized inner robot. Which would be a perfect base for a proper Pretender Thunderwing and would also make sense of FP not making a CW Thunderwing.
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Nov 14, 2016 14:23:19 GMT
Imagine how crazy it would be if PART III was based around the forgotten gimmick of...COLOUR CHANGE! THE RETURN OF DELUGE AND CHUMS! BUT THIS TIME... EVERYONE IS A DELUGE! -Ralph You fool! You would call up the Great Deluge?? |
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Post by Andy Turnbull on Nov 14, 2016 17:17:24 GMT
13 Primes is a dead end I think. That's an aligned continuity/movie thing. It isn't. The 13 originated as far back as G2. It was DW G1 continuity that it really started to take shape, and it's the central premise behind IDW G1's colony worlds. Aligned was to be Hasbro's focus for their 13 fanfics, but as Aligned is dead in the water, they need a new dumping ground for it. The 13 didn't originate in G2. The Liege Maximo was merely hinted as being something of a primogenitor to at least Megatron, if not Decepticons as a whole. When the concept of the 13 was brought in, it was retconned that he was one of the 13. Andy |
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Post by Andy Turnbull on Nov 14, 2016 17:19:28 GMT
I still think Pretenders will be next. It's not going to be Micromasters simply as the Titanmasters ticks the Head/Target/Power/Micro box - in terms of size, so they wouldn't be distinct enough.
They let Fun Pub and Botcon dry-run Pretenders with Optimus and Megatron.
I can see a Wheelie sized inner-robot in a larger shell coming our way and smaller Titanmaster friendly Pretender Shells as well.
Andy
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Post by The Doctor on Nov 14, 2016 18:00:59 GMT
Imagine how crazy it would be if PART III was based around the forgotten gimmick of...COLOUR CHANGE! THE RETURN OF DELUGE AND CHUMS! BUT THIS TIME... EVERYONE IS A DELUGE! -Ralph You fool! You would call up the Great Deluge?? |
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Post by Pinwig on Nov 14, 2016 19:02:16 GMT
It's believed something was a dry run for CW, but I'll be damned if i know what that is. Fandom logic perplexes me. FoC Bruticus I would think. He came as far before CW as Brainstorm did TR. There are a lot of characters in that game, for the few toys that did come out Hasbro didn't have to pick the combiner. |
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Nov 14, 2016 19:07:12 GMT
You fool! You would call up the Great Deluge?? A transformable Ark would be strangely appropriate... But such a line would place Phil in a bind. How could he review them... without losing them?? |
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Post by Toph on Nov 15, 2016 0:03:18 GMT
It isn't. The 13 originated as far back as G2. It was DW G1 continuity that it really started to take shape, and it's the central premise behind IDW G1's colony worlds. Aligned was to be Hasbro's focus for their 13 fanfics, but as Aligned is dead in the water, they need a new dumping ground for it. The 13 didn't originate in G2. The Liege Maximo was merely hinted as being something of a primogenitor to at least Megatron, if not Decepticons as a whole. When the concept of the 13 was brought in, it was retconned that he was one of the 13. Andy You are correct. Furman didn't start with the 13 until 2004. I'd thought I'd read it was something he had in his head since G2, and retconned the last autobot into it. But still, my original point does stand that the 13 originated in a G1 timeline, and exists in the UT. Thus it's not exclusively an Aligned thing. |
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Post by Toph on Nov 29, 2016 18:08:26 GMT
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primenova
Fusilateral Quintro Combiner
Posts: 6,057
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Post by primenova on Nov 29, 2016 19:11:25 GMT
Could we see toys reveals before Feb 2017?
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