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Post by Bogatan on Mar 23, 2023 21:11:38 GMT
As Im Manchestering tomorrow I went a sailing today. Spoiler
Kirks body?
So I had two thoughts, its Kirk so leaving on a random planet may not be a good long term option, but why keep at Daystrom? Well I suppose he time travelled... maybe? Or its a nod too Shatners novels where he was reanimated by the Borg? Not sure how that series ended but hes had nearly 30 years to die (again) and maybe Borg Kirk is interesting/dangerous enough to keep locked up.
Wasnt eally taking that theory seriously, but then.
Then the ending, they had Picards body too. And what was interesting about him? Assimilation?
I know this is just going to be an injoke and of no importance, but it did manage to amuse me.
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Post by Toph on Mar 24, 2023 9:43:52 GMT
So while it makes total sense, I'm a little disappointed that the Moriarty cameo turned out to not actually be him.
Although I'm glad the real Moriarty isn't suffering the fate we saw, I still just feel there's more to his story. While difficult, he would have been one of the few TNG characters/elements that would have been logical to get followed up on in Voyager.
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Post by Llama God on Mar 25, 2023 9:12:26 GMT
Eh...
This wasn't a bad episode by any means. But it also didn't click with me. I know that I should've been excited to see all those starships at the Fleet Museum, but it felt forced, and not organic. Between that and the artifacts on Daystrom Station it felt like they were just rubbing all of these nostalgia elements in my face because I was meant to like it. "Look at this, you like this! Like this! You MUST like this!"
Or maybe I'm just salty because they didn't include the Enterprise D's saucer which, per a plaque seen in the first episode of Season 2, is also meant to be there.
But what really annoyed me was the discovery of Dataloreb4whatever. I mean, we already knew that Spiner was coming back this season, despite insisting on his character being killed off previously. Twice. And the way that Data's going to return, if indeed he is, actually makes plenty of sense given all the in-universe events and artefacts. The problem is that they already fucked it with everything they did in Season 1. If we'd not had the Data stuff in that season, with the reveal that they'd rebuilt his personality from particles of positrons they found floating around in space, which was just nonsense anyway, then I would've been fine with this. But we've already gone through the emotions of Data's return and subsequent passing, and as such this now feels lazy. Which is annoying, because this is what they should've done in the first place. Now we just have to have a Spiner Acting Masterclas to look forwards to in upcoming stories, as he shows us how he can play four personalities at once...
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Mar 25, 2023 22:54:34 GMT
The nods were handled well. Didn't feel forced to me.
And a Spiner acting masterclass? Yes..! Masks II!! Bring it. |
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Post by Bogatan on Mar 26, 2023 19:34:19 GMT
Burgle. Shaw. Reaction.
Shaw. Geek out. Reaction.
Not sure which of the two was the best moment of the episode.
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Post by Llama God on Mar 27, 2023 7:34:39 GMT
Shaw does continue to be one of the best things about this series.
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Post by primenova on Mar 27, 2023 8:09:43 GMT
Just watched series 1 to the latest series 3 (think it was ep6) points in the series where they seem to go off with new story plot & drop the one then go back to it. Do they film the series out of order like they do with films? So film one story line but then cut it across different episodes?
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Post by The Doctor on Mar 27, 2023 11:21:52 GMT
!!!!
-Ralph
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Post by Grand Moff Muffin on Mar 27, 2023 17:12:12 GMT
Shaw does continue to be one of the best things about this series. Does this person get to go on holiday in an episode entitled Shaw Leave? And if not, why not? Martin |
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Post by Llama God on Mar 28, 2023 7:28:59 GMT
Shaw does continue to be one of the best things about this series. Does this person get to go on holiday in an episode entitled Shaw Leave? And if not, why not? Alas in this age of streaming and serialised stories there is no room for such frivolity. But they absolutely should do that. |
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primenova
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Post by primenova on Mar 28, 2023 8:56:47 GMT
So its every friday the next episode is added? Just looking at dates on imdb. So all 10 epsiodes each series. I did find on parmount + that for series 1 it did skip some. Unless didnt load ep3,6 up on episode list - but is showing all up right now
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Post by Hero on Mar 28, 2023 22:25:00 GMT
Been catching up with this series. I mark for Liam Shaw too.
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Post by Cullen on Mar 29, 2023 19:36:02 GMT
I've just caught up too. So much better than seasons 1 and 2 (which I liked despite obvious flaws). Add me to the Shaw fanclub.
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Post by Toph on Mar 31, 2023 3:03:51 GMT
Episode 7: THAT IS THE MOST EVIL CLIFFHANGER SINCE BEST OF BOTH WORLDS!
But at least it's not leaving it for a whole summer. |
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Post by The Doctor on Mar 31, 2023 21:18:23 GMT
I was on the edge of my seat!
I am now getting sad that we only have 3 episodes left before we have to say goodbye to the TNG crew, perhaps forever.
*blubs*
-Ralph
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Post by Llama God on Apr 1, 2023 9:07:56 GMT
Well...
That was okay.
The Brent Spiner Acting Masterclass was actually more understated than I was expecting, and actually didn't hate it. Which was the big surprise of the episode for me.
What did disappoint me was that this episode they finally became Idiots On A Spaceship. "Idiots On/In A..." is a genre of show that I've identified in which the main characters make stupid decisions in order to keep the plot moving. Snowpiercer is a prime example of this, being "Idiots on a Train", but there are many others. This week the Titan crew made the mistake of plugging Dataloreb4 into the ship's systems so that he could take control - which is stupid considering that Data used to take control of the Enterprise and be a major security hazard at least once a season. And their failure to properly protect the bridge, especially after regaining control of the ship from Lore, was also not in keeping with how they'd been acting for the rest of the episode.
But the big, big warning for me was the throwaway line that Picard's Irumodic Syndrome was a mis-diagnosis of something bigger. Something that we're going to find out makes Picard even more specialerer than he ever realised. And that's why they're after Jack. It might turn out to be something that makes sense, but I'm getting alarm bells right now...
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Post by Andy Turnbull on Apr 1, 2023 9:30:25 GMT
I enjoyed episode 7. {Spoiler}I didn't mind the Data/Lore bit as they had shut him down, and you could argue the fact the two were fighting for control means he/they wouldn't necessarily have been expected to grab control of the ship.
Wonder if the non-irumodic syndrome thing is possibly something that happened as a result of his time as Locutus, rather than him being special, etc. |
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Post by Philip Ayres on Apr 1, 2023 9:38:06 GMT
Eh...
This wasn't a bad episode by any means. But it also didn't click with me. I know that I should've been excited to see all those starships at the Fleet Museum, but it felt forced, and not organic. Between that and the artifacts on Daystrom Station it felt like they were just rubbing all of these nostalgia elements in my face because I was meant to like it. "Look at this, you like this! Like this! You MUST like this!"
Or maybe I'm just salty because they didn't include the Enterprise D's saucer which, per a plaque seen in the first episode of Season 2, is also meant to be there.
Prediction D Saucer in final episode as part of the solution/finale |
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Post by Toph on Apr 1, 2023 13:14:47 GMT
Eh...
This wasn't a bad episode by any means. But it also didn't click with me. I know that I should've been excited to see all those starships at the Fleet Museum, but it felt forced, and not organic. Between that and the artifacts on Daystrom Station it felt like they were just rubbing all of these nostalgia elements in my face because I was meant to like it. "Look at this, you like this! Like this! You MUST like this!"
Or maybe I'm just salty because they didn't include the Enterprise D's saucer which, per a plaque seen in the first episode of Season 2, is also meant to be there.
Prediction D Saucer in final episode as part of the solution/finale At one time I'd have never questioned the absence of the D Saucer.
It crashed. It crashed during a time when these were Space Ships, and never intended fly, let alone get up again after crashing, and ships like Voyager were extremely special, and even then Landing was a whole Thing they didn't do often.
They would have had no way to clean up the mess of the Enterprise's crash landing, except to disassemble it and beam it up in bits. After that, why bother putting a ruined spaceship back together, just for tourists?
But post Enterprise Trek, crashing and landing seems par for the course, with ships far less sturdy and sophisticated than the E-D crashing multiple times, then just getting up with maybe the paint scratched?
So yeah, why not just fly the D Saucer back home?
...i think this may be one of the genuine issues I have with new trek. (And yes, I know the answer is effects have gotten easier and cheaper for it. But it made sense even if practical effects weren't restrictive before) |
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Post by Bogatan on Apr 1, 2023 15:10:44 GMT
Prediction Spoiler
D Saucer in final episode as part of the solution/finale Spoiler
At one time I'd have never questioned the absence of the D Saucer.
It crashed. It crashed during a time when these were Space Ships, and never intended fly, let alone get up again after crashing, and ships like Voyager were extremely special, and even then Landing was a whole Thing they didn't do often.
They would have had no way to clean up the mess of the Enterprise's crash landing, except to disassemble it and beam it up in bits. After that, why bother putting a ruined spaceship back together, just for tourists?
But post Enterprise Trek, crashing and landing seems par for the course, with ships far less sturdy and sophisticated than the E-D crashing multiple times, then just getting up with maybe the paint scratched?
So yeah, why not just fly the D Saucer back home?
...i think this may be one of the genuine issues I have with new trek. (And yes, I know the answer is effects have gotten easier and cheaper for it. But it made sense even if practical effects weren't restrictive before) Spoiler
The D crashed on an inhabited world so theres no question the Saucer would have been removed (along with Kirks body). Wether they spent time fixing the structure enough to fit some kind of flight system or chopped it in to transportable pieces is the only real question.
Either way they would still have got it back in display worthy condition considering they rebuilt one of the ships destroyed at Wolf 359.
Wait a minute, was that Sisko ship?
As its not a whole ship it might be on display inside the station.
Also even just the saucer section is so massive it might not fit comfortable in one of those docks. |
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Post by Toph on Apr 1, 2023 17:10:08 GMT
Oh yeah, they removed it. I never implied they left it. Even if the world was uninhibited, they wouldn't just leave a giant piece of a galaxy class starship laying around.
Just that pre-discovery I unquestioningly assumed they dismantled it, as it had been established canon that most ships can't fly (especially crashed ones).
Since disco though, most ships can not only fly, but get up from a crash landing and leave on its own. Now, no matter how little sense it makes, there's no real canon reason the E-D saucer couldn't fly itself out with repairs. |
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Apr 1, 2023 18:40:39 GMT
I enjoyed episode 7. {Spoiler}
Wonder if the non-irumodic syndrome thing is possibly something that happened as a result of his time as Locutus, rather than him being special, etc. Yes, I had that thought too. The Borg were described as rewriting his DNA at the time so he could've had long term changes that were passed on to Jack. If Jack is even Picard's actual son.
Lots of unknowns though with Jack still... telepathy, mental control of others, visions, enhanced reflexes....
Have had the thought that he *is* the Picard duplicate Changling that is going to cause the trouble on Frontier Day replacing the original Jack but now so perfect he himself believes to be the real thing? |
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Post by Jim on Apr 1, 2023 20:39:26 GMT
Enjoyed it yet again, but more reservations than usual (mostly what Llama God said).
Super tense moment for Shaw fans in there!
I still think he's not going to survive the show, and the writers will have a hard job convincing me that that is necessary. The Wolf 359 stuff screamed set-up-for-a-self-sacrifice, but Shaw becomes a bit less of an asshole through an adventure with the older generation would be a better story. I hope I'm wrong. That's not how Trek, and TV in general, tends to go these days though - building up and killing off a character for The Feels is much more the way for better or worse.
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Post by Jim on Apr 1, 2023 20:57:20 GMT
I enjoyed episode 7. {Spoiler}
Wonder if the non-irumodic syndrome thing is possibly something that happened as a result of his time as Locutus, rather than him being special, etc. Yes, I had that thought too. The Borg were described as rewriting his DNA at the time so he could've had long term changes that were passed on to Jack. If Jack is even Picard's actual son.
Lots of unknowns though with Jack still... telepathy, mental control of others, visions, enhanced reflexes....
Have had the thought that he *is* the Picard duplicate Changling that is going to cause the trouble on Frontier Day replacing the original Jack but now so perfect he himself believes to be the real thing?
The weird bit with Beverly wanting to kill Vadic had me absolutely sure she was a Changeling (I thought that scene would end with Picard realising this and turning the gun on her, I was surprised it went as it did).
Now my theory is that she's a "good" Changeling who liberated "Jack" from Daystrom before the other Changelings could get to him.
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Apr 1, 2023 22:05:53 GMT
And that's maybe why she didn't contact any of them for 20 years... she's been a Changling since the end of the Dominion War (or later)... |
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Post by Llama God on Apr 2, 2023 9:19:41 GMT
Enjoyed it yet again, but more reservations than usual (mostly what Llama God said).
Super tense moment for Shaw fans in there!
I still think he's not going to survive the show, and the writers will have a hard job convincing me that that is necessary. The Wolf 359 stuff screamed set-up-for-a-self-sacrifice, but Shaw becomes a bit less of an asshole through an adventure with the older generation would be a better story. I hope I'm wrong. That's not how Trek, and TV in general, tends to go these days though - building up and killing off a character for The Feels is much more the way for better or worse.
Or, worse, kill him off, have everyone stand around crying, and then bring him back three minutes later. Which makes the whole process pointless.
I am hoping they don't kill him, since I like him as a character (if not quite so much as a person) and would like to see more of him in future shows. Which they must be thinking of.
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Post by Llama God on Apr 2, 2023 9:20:58 GMT
And that's maybe why she didn't contact any of them for 20 years... she's been a Changling since the end of the Dominion War (or later)...
That didn't occur to me at all - I just read that as Beverley being so upset at the active threats to her son that she'd kill to protect him. But that is an interesting possibility...
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Post by Bogatan on Apr 2, 2023 10:36:49 GMT
Spoiler
And that's maybe why she didn't contact any of them for 20 years... she's been a Changling since the end of the Dominion War (or later)... That hadnt occurred to me, but sort of fits with my theory. Spoiler
Ive been assuming its going to be more to do with the Borg collective as a substitute for the great link/mass mind control device.
Not sure they have said if the changlings have lost access to the great link but, I got the impression they had anyway or at least that heir relationship had changed. That would make the Borg collective a potentially appealing thing to them. Either as a link replacement or a way to take over the Federation.
They've also suggested Picards illness may have been misdiagnosed and his assimilation seems a likely alternative cause.
Jacks shown some type of collective control this episode suggesting what was done to Picard can be inherited/spread.
There was also Geordies mention of all the ships being interlinked, meaning at a gathering of the entire fleet theres an established way to "spread" something.
And I am almost certainly wrong but I felt Kirks body was also a hint towards this as he was revived by the borg in the Shatner series of books. though realistically his time in the nexus would also potentially be justification for his body being stored.
If my theory is even remotely close. A Changling Crusher would make Jack a Borg Changling hybrid which would explain why they are so keen to get a hold of him.
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Post by Fortmax2020 on Apr 2, 2023 12:58:12 GMT
The other theory I have is it is all to do with Crusher's space ghost lover... who never really left her..! Planet Scotland may yet return! |
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Post by Andy Turnbull on Apr 2, 2023 13:17:34 GMT
{Spoiler}STOP DRINKING NOW! |
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